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Hi !
While I was exploring my app.box, I found this.
My last rehearsal as a saxophonist... (August 2020)
It was the second and last rehearsal, we stopped because it didn't sound very well.
Box
Tell me what was wrong there ?
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08-27-2023 05:08 AM
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I can only really hear the sax through my computer's miniature buzzers pretending to be speakers, so that is all I can tell you about.
Originally Posted by Lionelsax
As a guitarist, I have noticed that people in general will hear a guitarist and think they sound fine, even pretty good, while I would say they were not so good, or even pretty poor. That is because the people in general don't know what's going on and I do, and I am pretty critical of music and musicians. I imagine this is a general thing - people that play an instrument are best informed to make the judgement of how well another plays it.
I played the Bb clarinet since a child, so I have a little idea of what the sax is about, and I don't hear anything in your sax playing I don't like. You sound like the real deal to me.
Was "it didn't sound very well" the feeling of some of the others, or the whole group, or just yourself? In any case, was it discussed among yourselves at the time?Last edited by pauln; 08-27-2023 at 12:42 PM.
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See, having been in bands for the last 25 years, I have a lower expectation than my non-musician wife. She expects greatness from bands, an improvement over listing to recorded music. As for me, someone who understands how hard everything you don't see is(learning songs, controlling rehersals, firing people who don't practice, booking and promoting a gig... all that stuff). I can enjoy a group if they are in tune and playing in time together. Originally Posted by pauln
As for Lionel's recordings, you're lacking feel. Girl From Ipanema had no bossa feel, it felt slow but not in a tempo way. The notes were dragging like Lester Young on a blues instead of hitting right on the beat like music to dance to.
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To put it simply, more vibrato is needed. You know, you make your mouth go "waa-waa-waa" whilst blowing a note. Good controlled vibrato is all you need, The Tenor Sax really is an instrument that sounds close to the human voice, so make it YOUR voice. Originally Posted by Lionelsax
Here's an example of a very, very simple and slow tune made magical by vibrato (ok, it's on a Baritone but have a listen anyway)
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Too bad you threw in the towel so quickly. You have a beautiful tone on the tenor. Originally Posted by Lionelsax
Overall, the whole thing sounds super amateurish, but you can develop that. I'll bet, we've all sounded like this at some point. Except for Stan Getz and Jaco Pastorius, but they're long dead.
I only listened to the "Girl", but if you can't even play the melody safely and with impetus, such a slow tempo is deadly of course. Also one can hear that the embouchure is not stable and confident, but that has also to do with the slow tempo. And it can be "practiced out"
The bass player sounds bad and plays too simple given there is not much else there. But that can be changed too if the will to work is given.
As I said, sounds amateurish but could be improved.... I wouldn't give up the sax entirely....
PS.: And don't forget, this was recorded with a crappy tape (or whatever) recorder in a rehearsal room! Don't compare this to a mixed studio recording... PLEASE!
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Did you not get enough feedback on SOTW? So now you want to ask guitar guys, eh. I presume you are also on the trumpet forum. Those guys are really good.
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Originally Posted by jazzereh
Did you not get enough feedback on SOTW? So now you want to ask guitar guys, eh. I presume you are also on the trumpet forum. Those guys are really good.
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Lionel, what is all this? Why are you going back to 2020?
You haven't stopped playing the saxophone anyway. You've done lots of very good stuff here with saxophone. I'm not going to tell you what was wrong with that music back in 2020, you can hear it for yourself.
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Um...You beat up the bass player for not knowing the changes to Autumn in NY, and couldn't find another one, because you got the reputation for being a sax player that beats up bass players? Originally Posted by Lionelsax
I don't know, you get a nice sound out of the horn, but maybe you lacked enough breath support to play with more energy?
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Oh thanks very much, I was talking about playing with a band or something like that. Originally Posted by ragman1
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You're not so far from the truth, I figured out I was able to do everything by myself. Originally Posted by sgcim
Lack of energy, that's sure when it's a duet like this...
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lacking feel, dragging, not hitting right on the beat
more vibrato is needed, go "waa-waa-waa"
embouchure is not stable and confident
lacked enough breath support to play with more energy
Please regard the criticisms with due caution!
Lacking a happy rigid feel is good jazz playing
Playing that hits right on the beat is less jazzy
Playing with a nice beat-width is not dragging
The vibrato example of Red Rose is ludicrous
Mouth & breath - haven't you heard jazz sax?
I think some are imagining the sound of sax a
caricature, like the way somebody might think
the right sounds for the guitar has to push the
stringy sound energy for chords, a bendy lead
line, or that the right sound for a piano comes
from the approach and style of pounding on it.
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Was able to listen to TGFI...I rather liked your tone. The whole thing is loose, and maybe sounds unrehearsed...but I dunno. I enjoyed it. I would definitely not stop.
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Thanks, I don't stop, I was about to, I didn't play it anymore in bands because I couldn't find people who were able to play without losing themselves in the chord changes. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
So I began to play a little bit more the guitar for myself then a lot more.
I also played the 7 string guitar to avoid some situations.
At first the saxophone helped me a lot for my guitar playing, now it's the opposite (learning simple tunes without scores but only with my guitar experience).
Now people know me better as a guitarist, they heard me playing the saxophone and wanted me to play it again but I refused because of one of the reasons I mentioned.
When you are more preoccupied about what they play, you can't play. You can't anticipate.
They want me to play the saxophone but they also complain because it's too loud.
They want the sound but not too loud so there is a lack of dynamics and intentions.
I can play with a kind of classical embouchure but I dislike the sound, a lack of technique for sure, my saxophones are not in a good shape but work well with a jazz embouchure even if it doesn't exist.
A lot of subtone sounds, sometimes the sound doesn't come instantly, we could call this "latence".
Be sure I won't give up.
I don't know why I'm so aggressive in my thinking...
I know really nice musicians who want me to play the saxophone again.
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