Circus in Rhythm

[AllanAllen]

Is this Honeysuckle Rose changes?

I’ve been trying to shoehorn it into Rhythm Changes because of the name, but the bridge definitely isn’t right.

[Bop Head]

| IV7 / / / | IV7 / / / | I / / / | I7 / / / | IV7 / / / | IV7 / / / | I / / / | II7 V7 |

not Honeysuckle bridge

very close to blues changes

TBH how can you recognize blues changes if you cannot hear those bridge changes?


EDIT: A section is rhythm changes.

[Bop Head]

Another high recommendation from my side on getting a copy of Philippe Baudoin's "Jazz : Mode d'Emploi : Volume 1" which is in French, but the chapter on essential typical 4-, 8-, and 16-measure jazz chord progressions can be understood without speaking the author's language. Those progressions are the 20+ progressions most jazz tunes can be reduced to according to e.g. Hal Galper or Bruce Forman.

Practice those patterns in all keys a lot until you have no more problems recognizing them. And think in Roman numerals instead of chord names.

[AllanAllen]

|
TBH how can you recognize blues changes if you cannot hear those bridge changes?

Honestly I expected Rhythm Changes, when it wasn't I tried playing it over Honeysuckle based on the guitar/piano break. Sounded like Freddy was going between 2 chords, so I thought maybe Honeysuckle.

I can hear blues changes because it's happening in a blues. I haven't put much work into learning changes by ear because of my lead sheet crutch. If I get lost in a tune I know, I know what to expect and I can get back in But learning changes by ear, well. I obviously gave up too early because a bunch of IV to I isn't hard to figure out.

Anyway, thanks. I learned two things from you, the bridge, and don't expect everything to be cookie cutter.

[Bop Head]

Honestly I expected Rhythm Changes, when it wasn't I tried playing it over Honeysuckle based on the guitar/piano break. Sounded like Freddy was going between 2 chords, so I thought maybe Honeysuckle.

I can hear blues changes because it's happening in a blues. I haven't put much work into learning changes by ear because of my lead sheet crutch. If I get lost in a tune I know, I know what to expect and I can get back in But learning changes by ear, well. I obviously gave up too early because a bunch of IV to I isn't hard to figure out.

Anyway, thanks. I learned two things from you, the bridge, and don't expect everything to be cookie cutter.

I was wondering today if my wording could be taken as a little bit too harsh and I am glad that you could accept my criticism as constructive as it was intended.

A Disclaimer: My own active ear training goes back to my 6th or 7th grade in school when I was probably the only one in my class who found it interesting being taught what a tonic, a subdominant or a dominant was and, taking classical piano lessons at that time, had to immediately try that out at home. That must have been ca. 40 years ago if my calculations are correct. (My passive ear training goes back to pre-natal imprint through my mother deliberately listening to a lot of classical music while being pregnant, more listening to classical music and a lot of singing as a toddler and recorder flute lessons from the age of six on.) And I haven't stopped since then. At the time I started to teach myself guitar at sixteen (35 years ago) I also read a lot of biographies which inspired me to learn songs by Chuck Berry and The Beatles by ear just like Hendrix, Beatles, Stones or Clapton did in their youth as well. Soon I started to discover jazz through blues as well and started to engage in music theory and jazz harmony. So my sense of hearing is rather advanced and developed after all those years and I do not want to sound arrogant to someone who is in a earlier stage of development.

I recommend anyone who has problems hearing changes to start simple. A Bob Dylan or Beatles tune is easier to decipher by ear than say Stella by Starlight.

What also helped me a lot to develop my hearing further was to use the drop 2 voicings that I had practiced a lot because of the Barry Harris sixth diminished stuff and practice chord progressions with all possible inversions with the closest voice leading available. That and practicing the progressions as simple (guitar) shell voicings through all keys. (If you learn to remember chord progressions by Roman numerals rather than by chord names the thing with practicing progressions as shell voicings through all keys is rather a question of when to do bigger jumps within a useful tonal and reachable range on the guitar. Apart from that transposing is simply a question of shifting the whole things a few frets up or down.)

[AllanAllen]

I was wondering today if my wording could be taken as a little bit too harsh and I am glad that you could accept my criticism as constructive as it was intended.

You know at first I was like, where does this guy get off. But then you know, it was a valid question. How can I hear my way though a blues and also not hear a bunch of IV to I movement. Listening with expectation, trying to put the tune in one of the cliche forms I already know, instead of listening to what they're playing like I would if I was learning a Fats Domino, Buck Owens or Chuck Berry song.