Impossible Howard Roberts Chord

[zdub]

Every so often I open up the Howard Roberts Chord Melody book. Some good stuff. But I was always taken aback by the following G6 (Em7) chord which he uses as an example in closed voicings and elsewhere. I mean, I have fairly large hands but playing this chord - which spans 7 frets - down at the 3rd fret? Sheesh.

[Lionelsax]

People who like to use their thumb on the 1st string.

[zdub]

People who like to use their thumb on the 1st string.

Ain't no thumb in that chord.

[Lionelsax]

Ain't no thumb in that chord.

I'm sorry if you didn't understand, I didn't mean the thumb over the neck but on the other side, like a cellist.
X X 9 7 5 3
Thumb on G note.

[Lionelsax]

Even with the thumb, I can't play it, but I've got a solution...

I hope you know which notes are in this chord, supposing your a real guitarist I will begin high to low.

Left hand

first finger on G (3rd fret)
second finger on E (5th fret)
fourth finger on D (7th fret)

Right hand

index on B (9th fret)


Now, low to high

Thumb is plucking B (4th string)
Major is plucking D (3rd string)
Ring is plucking E (2nd string)
Pinky is plucking G (1st finger)


Like Lenny Breau used to say, with his chords with harmonics... You just need, 3 or 4 weeks, and sometimes it doesn't work.

[Onlyserious]

It is wicked hard to play in the third position, but quite playable further up the neck. It is a fairly common Western Swing chord that I learned from a Joe Dalton video.

A couple hip things about it... Using it as a I6, you can voice lead into a IV7 just by lowering your pinky a half-step.

I also use it to play to ascending doublestops to play the first three harmonized notes of I Got Rhythm (with F and C on top two strings for the fourth note.)

Another thing I do is play it on the head of Green Dolphin Street--after playing the C and Cminor, descend from the 10th D6,Db6, to C6... Unusual and very lush.

[rpjazzguitar]

I can't come anywhere close to fingering it that way.

It does work as x x 12 12 0 0. Same notes.

[rabbit]

H.R. offered this, but do you think he played it?

A wicked sense of humor, that fellow had.

[ragman1]

You can get exactly the same effect by just playing xx768x. No one will notice or care.

[runeo]

No problem for normal hand and finger length, to handle that chord, if you rise the guitar neck upwards, just 25 cm/10" from your ear.


Ted Greene

http://tedgreene.com/images/lessons/..._EbComping.pdf

Good Training from Ted Greene, attached. Test the EbMaj9 at the end of the third row.

OT: Play it and let the pinky go stepwise down to fret 5 and test what chords you can hear.
OT: Look at the first chords looking like Maj7 and m7 chords but are not just that. Very educational for me, at least.

A lot of stretching tests, that forces you to hold the guitar right.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Ted's sheets always look like a crowd of flies flew into a cloud of Raid.

[goldenwave77]

Ted Greene

http://tedgreene.com/images/lessons/..._EbComping.pdf

Good Training from Ted Greene, attached. Test the EbMaj9 at the end of the third row.

OT: Play it and let the pinky go stepwise down to fret 5 and test what chords you can hear.
OT: Look at the first chords looking like Maj7 and m7 chords but are not just that. Very educational for me, at least.

A lot of stretching tests, that forces you to hold the guitar right.

Question: Some of these chord grids have a diagonal slash mark, on the 4th string. What is this showing? (They're not roots, and they don't always indicate step-wise movement.)

[runeo]

Question: Some of these chord grids have a diagonal slash mark, on the 4th string. What is this showing? (They're not roots, and they don't always indicate step-wise movement.)

The hand written text in the upper left corner says : 2 Beats per chord unless marked 1.

[goldenwave77]

Ah so it does. Missed that.

Thanks.

[reventlov]

Reed Richards plays chords like that a lot.

[BigDaddyLoveHandles]

You can get exactly the same effect by just playing xx768x. No one will notice or care.

xx7680

[Lionelsax]

xx7680

You're absolutely right but it's too simple, it's fun to take a complicated way to play simple things in order to reinvent the wheel.

[ragman1]

xx7680

I just said that. But I left out the open E because, although it's the right note, it sounds like the wrong voicing. But it could be okay, I suppose.

I think the idea is to go from maj to dominant by sliding the G# to G (so maybe the G should be on top).

If you don't mind putting your wrist in a cast, that is...

[Lionelsax]

[Lionelsax]

On a 7 string guitar M3 tuning :

X X X 7 6 4 3
X X 11 10 8 7 X
X 15 14 12 11 X X

Maybe it could be easier with an 9 string guitar tuned like this (m3 tuning)

E G Bb C# E G Bb C# E

X X X X X 4 4 3 3

[eh6794]

I can ALMOST do it. I bet that guy with rubber fingers who looks like he's making out with his guitar can do it (can't think of his name, but if you know him, that description will be enough)

[BigDaddyLoveHandles]

Another crazy stretch I remember from Chord Chemistry is

xx.12.12.6.6 (Gm7)

I forget where Ted planted that on the fretboard, but note that G string is playing a higher note than the B string is playing!

I can play it as a C#m7
xx6600

[Robertkoa]

Haha !

I fell for the 'put headstock next to your ear trick'.

Some Fraternity Hazing Prank..I still can't reach it .

I use a lot of Root Position Closed Voicings 6 frets etc. and mini Barrès with different fingers but that is a Tendon Twister - it's an NBA Chord- basketball Players with huge hands use it presumably...

Plus TBH It's not that great sounding or dynamic or moody or Ambiguous - *get- you- back- to- the Home Key with no Dominant Chord .

* A Left Field Cadence...I call them.

I have small hands but my Fret Hand is 1/2" longer from Playing so long...

Anyway the hard part about that stretch is it's two fret stretches all across.

'We don't like super wide stretches unless it's a great chord either sounding or function...

The Academy therefore rejects this Chord....'

Ha.

So this chord doesn't sound great or lead somewhere that other C6 s can't or have amazing functions as a Pivot Chord OR get you Paid OR get you the Girl.
Too hard to play for the small Effect.
Rejected...lol.

** I have no credentials whatsoever to make these Judgements- true- but still what about the Academy quote....?

Docbop Below -Kidding aside - you studied with the Legendary Ted Greene -wow !

I was just on the PDF Site learning about his expanded Tonality - The improvised 2 and Bach/ Greenelike things he used to play on his Tele- I saw a Video- were so beautiful.

I assume he could Improv. Complete Chord Melodies that were amazing also...

[docbop]

Every so often I open up the Howard Roberts Chord Melody book. Some good stuff. But I was always taken aback by the following G6 (Em7) chord which he uses as an example in closed voicings and elsewhere. I mean, I have fairly large hands but playing this chord - which spans 7 frets - down at the 3rd fret? Sheesh.

Well when I was studying with Ted Greene I made a comment like that once. Ted put is hand on his leg and started pulling his fingers out further and further. Then said the cartilage will give some and you can stretch out further on the neck. Ted would sometime play some huge chord and then use his nose to hammer on a bass note. Where there's a will there's a way.

[jayv999]

These long stretch chords are usually classified by Ted Greene as V-1 voicing group types. They are close-voice chords.
I don't have a problem fingering the chord listed at the top of this thread, but I do have large hands. Another thing that helps is the angle in which you hold your guitar. Look at how Steve Herberman holds his instrument: it affords more ability to get those long stretches. No way if you hang your axe down by your hips or lower.

Check out Ted's V-System, and in particular the section on V-1 chord: TedGreene.com - Teachings