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Hey!
Been doing groove-feel stuff for a few months now..
I usually get it going after waking up, takes maybe an hour to practice until happy.
Then in the evening, when wanting to just play beautiful music, it is gone. And have to "restart" it. Takes a bit less time but it is annoying, still.
I've noticed that good players, doing interviews and also playing something right there on the spot, have always the groove going instantly.
None of them will warm up before such thing... pretty sure.
What's your experience with that?
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09-10-2024 06:14 AM
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The groove has to be in you and has to be available immediately.
I played rock, funk and reggae with a good drummer in a band of brothers for 10 years. In that band we jammed a lot, later we also organised a monthly public jam session as part of our weekly reggae sound system. I probably played 500+ concerts with that band, starting with youth center gigs, later national support tours with American bands .
Originally I wanted to be a drummer myself. I listen a lot -- consciously and unconsciously -- to how different instrument parts are intertwined. And I always hear drums in my head even if I am busking alone.
And I practiced cross rhythms a lot systematically.
All of this taught me to come up with musical ideas that groove immediately on the spot no matter what style.
Which reminds me I have to call the guy from Senegal I jammed with recently and who absolutely wants to start a musical project with me.
You can look at Spotify for a band called Les Babacools. That is where I am coming from.
EDIT: I do not think that you should practice groove on your own. Groove is something that happens when people play together.
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My jazz band instructor in university told us to stay out of the groove, that it was an enemy.
Anything you see on a screen is not real. Pros look good because they know how to work in front of a camera plus there is great editing nowadays. Pros play all the time so they are always warmed up and ready.
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Well, it should be in and available but always ain't. To be fair, imho, it sure is "on or off" type of thing. One of few that either "is or isn't" in music.
Originally Posted by Bop Head
And should be able to groove alone.
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That I can see how it can be true. But many pros watch lots of TV instead practicing. Originally Posted by DawgBone
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A simple trick I've learned is record all the time.
Obviously playing live and in groups helps a lot and helps work out your feel and facility, but even then you still don't know how it sounds. You can feel in the groove and it can still suck. That's why recording helps so much, it forces you to play as well as you can, and you can listen back and analyze how to improve it. When you're just dicking around practicing, it can be jankity and you won't ever build on anything. Recording consistently, if forces you to get in the groove and play well, then you can get used to playing like that and build on it.
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Of course you have to be able to groove alone but playing with others helps in learning to groove. Originally Posted by emanresu
The groove has to be in the body then it is always available.
It helps to dance -- no kidding. I remember reading this interview with drummer Omar Hakim 35 years ago who said when he is learning how to play a new style (IIRC in that case he was refering to hip-hop and new jack swing) he goes to a discotheque and dances to that music and watches how others dance to that music.
It also helps the more your body is relaxed, relax your shoulder area and relax the lower regions, think of the hips of e.g. Elvis or James Brown or Tina Turner dancing. African rhythm, which is one of the most important roots of jazz is a very physical thing.
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It’s the most important thing and discussed the least Originally Posted by emanresu
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Sounds like university of North Texas lol. Originally Posted by DawgBone
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It is the part of music where it seems to be most easy to play outside LOL. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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What practice setting are you playing in? Solo? Metronome? Tracks?
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I use a smart metronome that imitates sort of 4/4 swing, basically a drumloop. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Then record some comp for a tune with simple metronome on 2&4, then try to see how it grooves and record a solo on top.
Occasionally I play along with recordings but I feel that they make me kinda lazy
Because I'm just adding to something that already grooves well.
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Once you get comfortable try it on just the 4. The maybe the 2. Maybe the 4 every other bar.
And then maybe on the and of 4…
Then the click by tunes on every other eight note in the bar. Some easier than others.
Will keep you busy.
I used a settling in drill of quarter notes, up beats, groupings of 3, quarter triplets, half triplets.
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Peter Bernstein tip - don’t just set the click to tempos like 160, 180, 200, try in between tempos like 167, 193 and 202
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Play along more with recordings.
Metronomes are great, but they cannot teach you to groove.
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+1 Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Learn heads Miles played … that kind of thing.
Hard not to swing when you’re playing along with Paul Chambers all day.
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1.) A musical note does not only start at a certain point in time but it is also essentially inportant where it ends.
Note length (and the resulting empty space between notes) is a very important factor regarding groove.
2.) Dizzy Gillespie, a true master of rhythm, said he learned everything about rhythm "in the sanctified church". It will not hurt to pull out some old school gospel records from time to time to learn something about groove and phrasing.
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Atm, I have a 3-hour sleep deprivation and feeling numb. No groove happening at all.
Hence my theory got proven: it is all about feeling. And energy.
edit: somewhere here someone mentioned that time and feel are not the same. That seemed plausible but it kinda becomes obvious at some point.
Anyway, the OPs question was "What's your experience with that?"
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Playing in the groove often requires a certain mental state of relaxation and focus. This state can take time to achieve, especially if you're transitioning from different activities or emotional states throughout the day.
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I’m going to sound like reg for a second but my old guitar teacher used to say that the best thing to do for nerves is practice two months ago.
Just meaning that there are loads of things you can do to help yourself relax but it’s all supplementary to being comfortable with the material.
I wonder if groove is similar … you have to have it together. And that doesn’t mean you have to have insane chops to groove … but just that you have to have command of your material to the point where it’s second nature. There was this video going around the internet this week of D’Angelo strumming at a guitar shop. Nothing he was playing was mind blowing. But the pocket. was. DEEP.
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cosigned...thats where i heard it, and been taking awhile to undo it too Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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I have actually asked this exact question to a number of famous and mega-grooving players, jazz funk and ethnic genres when i was studying, how do i get better at groovin and playing hipper rhythm guitar. Literally 100% suggested i take a simple rhythm, like a funk or any groove music rhythm part, and play it all day!!
"Or two hours, or half an hour, or as long as you can keep it up"..
I have probably done this for 2-3 hours straight at the most. But also i 've had the same experience playing percussion at various instances, where you keep playing the same and the same thing, till it becomes a trance like thing, and all your focus is on deepening the groove. After 15 minutes you play better. After 30 even better, etc etc.. If you actually record yourself, you hear the difference. The better players can reach the one hour thing in a few minutes, the best right away.
So my suggestion, just play a simple James Brown part for one hour, see where it gets you, as far as groove music is concerned! For jazz, play along with CDs, transcribe, the usual..
My theory is, if someone has reached the point where they can really groove in a style of music, they have really mastered the style, it is one of the most difficult things to do..
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Very interesting. I have heard this advice before but never really follow through with it. Instead I was improvising with a bunch of different rhythms at a time (2 minutes for each rhythm). Sounds promising Originally Posted by Alter
I have actually asked this exact question to a number of famous and mega-grooving players, jazz funk and ethnic genres when i was studying, how do i get better at groovin and playing hipper rhythm guitar. Literally 100% suggested i take a simple rhythm, like a funk or any groove music rhythm part, and play it all day!! "Or two hours, or half an hour, or as long as you can keep it up"..
I have probably done this for 2-3 hours straight at the most. But also i 've had the same experience playing percussion at various instances, where you keep playing the same and the same thing, till it becomes a trance like thing, and all your focus is on deepening the groove. After 15 minutes you play better. After 30 even better, etc etc.. If you actually record yourself, you hear the difference. The better players can reach the one hour thing in a few minutes, the best right away.
So my suggestion, just play a simple James Brown part for one hour, see where it gets you, as far as groove music is concerned! For jazz, play along with CDs, transcribe, the usual.. My theory is, if someone has reached the point where they can really groove in a style of music, they have really mastered the style, it is one of the most difficult things to do..
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Yeah. Thats pretty much the only way how to get it home alone. Originally Posted by jazznylon
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One enemy of groove is not having the chops or confidence to play the part well. Or is that two enemies of groove?
It's not going to groove if you're lagging behind.
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