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I am a long-time lurker, first time posting here.
Long story short, I practically gave away my Fender Blues Deluxe Reissue which I had modified with new speaker, modkit and so on, to a friend whose son is starting to play guitar more seriously. His grandparents purchased an archtop for him, and he got into a jazz program in school, and he needed a good tube amp.
That Fender was my first and only tube amp for years. I am now thinking of getting something better.
I guess ideally, I would get a twin, but I am concerned about the weight/volume, and in any case, I fear my jamming days are behind me for now. Does anyone own or use a Fender Custom 68 pro Reverb? I would get a Deluxe 65 Reissue but the lack of bright switch and mids kind of bothers me. The Pro seems like it has the headroom/bright switch/mid knob of a Twin but without the weight/volume.
In the end, I just want an all-tube Fender amp with headroom, reverb and tremolo that is not going to need many trips to an amp tech.
Any insights would be a big help!
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12-20-2024 08:11 PM
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I played a new Gibson ES 335 at GC the other day. Plugged into a Pro Reverb. It sounded great. Yes, bright switch and Mid control - all good things to have, though I prefer to not use the Br Sw, but you may. Mid control - YES. Very useful, and the amp had one spkr. so, it was not a huge amp - easily transported and not taking up too much space. And..... great tone BTW. I wanted it!
You probably don't need a Twin. Why? Kind of overkill, unless you are gigging in big big rooms. Yes, some of them give you a great sound with 2 spkrs, but.... so do the smaller amps. Go and play some. If I was to need a 2 spkr amp, I'd be thinking a Vibrolux Reverb. Always wanted one.
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I played through a silverface twin a few years back in a rockabilly band. It belonged to the drummer. It was a great amp and all, but yeah that is a whole lot of amp! Too much for most people's needs these days, but then you know twins are so much more affordable now because they have become impractical. Just not as desirable as a Deluxe I guess.
It is tough not to be swayed by the reviews of the Custom Pro that mention rattle and hiss and all. I guess it goes with the territory of a loud combo. Another issue is that so many people purchase gear online without trying it first.
Great to hear about your experience with the amp, and I am definitely going to be putting one to the test before purchasing one. It seems like every piece of gear I have purchased in the past years has had to go to a tech for some adjustments/repairs. Quality is really nosediving while prices are going up.
Just surprising to see zero buzz about this amp in the jazz guitar community. I suppose there are just so many options out there. I am stuck on Fender tube amps though.
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New Fender=Overpriced junk amps.
I hear people compare the Pro to the Twin all the time. They aren't anything alike because the Pro is tube rectified and has smaller transformers. It gets real squishy at volume whereas the Twin stays pretty tight all the way up the dial.
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A new '68 Custom Pro Reverb is $1600 brand new. For that same price, you can take your pick of several different Silverface models. Personally, I'd go with the Vibrolux Reverb because I like 10" speakers with archtops more than 12" ones. And 35 watts is enough clean headroom for most jazz gigs.
I'd also look into many of the Fender clones out there. Most are hand wired similar to the vintage originals (unlike modern Fenders). Mojotone, Marsh, Vintage Sound, Lil Dawg, Headstrong, etc.
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The “Custom ‘68 Pro Reverb” has a SS rectifier, not a tube. It has smaller transformers than a Twin because it’s a 40W 1x12 and the Twin is an 85W 2x12. “All the way up the dial” is a much longer trip for a Twin - it’s still warming up when a Pro has the pedal to the metal.
Originally Posted by DawgBone
The current Fender production amps are indeed a far cry from the “real” ones we old guys know and love. But for home and light gigging use, they’re more than decent. For sure, reliability is compromised by the circuit board construction. I’ve been using a “Custom ‘68 Vibrolux” that’s in the backline at a local club weekly for several years. It’s failed and needed service at least 3 times since it was new, 2 of which were for broken traces on the main and PS boards (1 each). It does not sound like the original (I owned one for years). The reissue is not as sweet, robust and responsive to touch.
The Fender Custom Shop amps that are hand wired are much closer to the originals. We have a CS Princeton Reverb at the same club that sounds much more like the original, although I much prefer the sound of my ‘76 to it for warmth, richness, responsiveness etc - the original just plain has bigger balls.
I wouldn’t buy any new Fender amp except maybe a CS if I got it at a really good price. Three grand for the CS Princeton is ridiculous - you can get a great boutique amp for that much that will sound so much better and last a lot longer with much less attention. I still have a Twin and a Princeton, but they never leave home & I play them just for fun. I use a Quilter OD202 in a BlockDock 12HD for big gigs and a Henriksen Blu 6 for modest gigs. I also use a DV Mark EG250 head and either a Toob Metro or a 10” Toob for in between gigs, and the tube preamp in the EG250 has the warmth of a Fender tube amp.
At $1500 list, the current Pro seems like a weak alternative to me when so many SS & class D amps sound so good (especially those with a tube in the preamp). Sadly, if you want a tube amp like the old Fenders, you’ll have to spend twice as much or more for Carr, Victoria, etc.
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Tis a sad view on modern Fender amps ^^, but I appreciate your viewpoints. And Fender makes so many attractive amp choices!
Glad that I don't need any. My Princeton Reverb and PR II have been sweet, and too loud for some gigs. I don't play large venues.
Good luck in you searching Harry.
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Skip the Fender Tube thing altogether. Go with a used Quilter gen 1 or 2 Aviator 1x12” Combo. All of the great Clean Fender Tone without any drawbacks like re tubing,wall voltage dependent,servicing at all!
Quilter Aviator AV200-112 1x12 Guitar Amp Combo (Used) Reverb Posting!
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I have two Twins which I've owned since 2015 and 2018. I've had them to the tech two or three times each for tubes and bias, a power cable failure on one and cathode bypass resistors failing on the other. I was able to squeeze a lot of gigs out of a $500 '72 Twin. It even pulled keyboard amp duty in a loud organ trio I had for a while. After probably 1000 fairly loud gigs, rehearsals, and recording sessions I had them both basically fully rebuilt and retubed last spring so I should be good for another ten or fifteen years but truthfully I try and blow them up at gigs as often as I can. The latest casualty was my trusty K120 finally developing a coil rub. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
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I have the impression that the 68 series of amps are designed for overdrive, not clean headroom. I have gigged the 68 deluxe and the 68 Princeton and they both gave me that impression, didn't like either one for jazz. I would look into the 65 series.
I agree that the current Fender amps are very overpriced, I wouldn't pay the money they're asking for a new one. I would get a clone, I have played several, they sound great, they can have better construction and components than the current fender ones, and cost about a third of the price.
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Check out the Hot Rod model that Fender makes for Michael Landau - it’s got huge clean headroom, a very useable EQ section and this at a reasonable price.
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Remember at the end of the gig when you’re tired and just want to get home. The Weight Factor of Tube Amps,Lol!
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Most jazz players I think are using smaller lower wattage amps these days, and often not tube. Originally Posted by Harry_Barnes
I would look around for something with real hand wiring if it were me, there are many smaller builders doing great variations on Fender designs that are worth looking at. Fat Jimmy is the one I have but there are many others. And of course there are vintage amps if you have the money.
And no, they should definitely not buzz or rattle! That tends to show a cheaply made cabinet. You want solid pine with a strong baffle board in this kind of amp.
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If you don't need to go anywhere with your amp, and you don't need to move it about at home, weight it not a problem. I have a Princeton Reverb II with an oak enclosure and a 200 W Electro-Voice speaker. It is too heavy and too valuable to go out. I treat it as furniture. My other amp can be carried with one hand.
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I had the epiphany on my way to a big band gig for the Drexel University Board of Trustees in the late '90s IIRC. The hall was huge and it was a straight ahead commercial date, so I brought a Twin and my 7 string Carvin hardtail. I parked, opened my trunk, and suddenly realized that if I hurt my back lifting the amp out, I wouldn't be able to do a lot of things I needed to do - you know, those little things like playing the gig, getting home, and going to work the next morning. So I very carefully took out the amp, got myself inside, and had a great night. Originally Posted by jads57
But by the time I got home, I'd already decided that I needed to find a smaller, lighter amp. I told my wife what had happened and vowed to sell all my big amps. The chase was on, and I went through many over the next 15+ years before technology came to my rescue. I backed off in steps, starting with the SF VIbrolux I already owned instead of the Twin and the Boogie. But it just didn't do the trick. I bought a RE 10 from Rich and drove it with everything from a Bassman 50 head I'd bought new years before to a Crate Powerblock to a few of the most powerful lunchbox heads that had just started to come out. I tried Vox, Mesa, Phil Jones, SWR, Genz-Benz, GK, and a host of others - but I never did find an amp in the then-current lines that had the power, the sound, and the size / weight package to make me happy.
Thankfully, we now have excellent and powerful little heads, great light cabs, killer little combos, and neo speakers that can handle the power but weigh almost nothing. Today's best gear can take the heat and keep on cooking, and it's easy to schlep around. I give thanks daily for Henriksen, Toob, RevSound, Quilter, Milkman, and all their kin!Last edited by nevershouldhavesoldit; 12-21-2024 at 07:18 PM.
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thanks so much for all of the insights everyone. I am glad no one recommended a TM Twin!
I would definitely consider let's say a vintage Fender (possibly silverface Twin or something that will not break the bank) for home use, and maybe a Mark DV 12 for any jams or what have you.
There is something to be said for owning an amp that is not the amp equivalent of a case queen.
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I have an old Pro Reverb, pre-master volume but I am not certain as to the specific year, which I've had since 1985 or something. It has 2 JBLs in it and hasn't left the house in probably 20 years because it's too damn heavy to pick up. Probably 70 lbs. I'd hurt myself. It's a great sounding amp, but it does start to exhibit a bit of hair around 4 on the volume control. There is something about having 2x12 inch speakers moving air around that creates something special, a sort of roundness that is hard to get otherwise. But it does not have the headroom and clarity of a Twin. I thought about putting a couple of Neo speakers in it, would probably bring the weight down by 20 pounds.
At 65, I no longer consider this a practical amp for gigs. I remember the days when I could carry it in one hand with my guitar in the other- from my pick up truck, up a flight of stairs to the gig and not think twice about it, and then take it home up another flight of stairs to my apartment. Ah, to be young and strong. I was working in a produce warehouse fresh out of college and could tote hundred pound sacks of potatoes and 50 pound sacks of onions, not to mention 36 pound boxes of bananas two at a time. Hand to get them trucks lumped and stuff into the cooler. I was a happy man when stuff came in already palletized. But I digress.
One of these days I've gotta put that thing on my local Craigslist and get rid of it. I have a tweed Deluxe that I use and gets me the sound I want.
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I did not recommend the TM series only due to your request for an all tubes amp. Otherwise I would have jumped in for such a recommendation. Originally Posted by Harry_Barnes
I have 6 or 7 tube amps at home, some are smaller and some are bigger amps. For outside gigs I use my TM Twin and none of the tube amps. The TM Twin is as lite as one of my 15 Watt tube amps. And has the typical big sound of a Fender Twin.
If you look for an amp for inhouse use only, no objections to a tube amp. At home, I use my tubes.
If you look for a vintage Fender like a SF, I hope you have enough skills for servicing a tube amp or you have someone on your hand to do that.
These old handwired amps are like old cars, built like a tank but may need a lot of maintenance.
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that makes a lot of sense to me - tube amps at home and an amp that travels easy
Thing is though, when I read of people purchasing a TM Twin or some such and dumping all their tube amps that really makes me wonder what they are thinking.
We can't let amps become as disposable as cell phones or tablets. After a few years, dump it and buy a new one. Amps contain electronics but hopefully musical instruments will not become this planned to become obsolete thing. A good amp should last a lifetime it seems to me, just like a good guitar or a Trumpet or a saxophone etc
I am eyeing a 79 SF Vibrolux. I am not sure I can afford a BF Deluxe or Twin. Plus as you point out, one downside of a vintage Twin is having to haul it to an amp tech once in a while!
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"We can't let amps become as disposable as cell phones or tablets" Originally Posted by Harry_Barnes
I don't mean to offend you with my statement here but you haven't been paying very close attention to recent developments in guitar amplification. Even those who "keep tube amps at home" are helping to cast them into obsolescence. Nothing made today is designed to "last a lifetime" either. It's all a bunch of disposable garbage. GARBAGE. Sonic improvements over previous designs is no longer the goal for the big manufacturers. Portability and convenience for lazy asses and max profit margin for the makers are the goals i.e digital modeling trash. So the industry has mostly failed already and it is brought about by consumers who knuckle under for those reasons instead of seeking absolute sonic excellence which is still found in tube amps.
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There's no shortage of old, inexpensive Fender tube amps, suitable for jazz, with lots of headroom. Effects can be added with any of the many pedals available. IMO, separating heads from cabs is a great solution to weight and bulk issues.
My last Fender amp project was a beat '70's Fender Bassman Ten amp, with 70 watts of loud, clean power (2x6L6, ultra-linear transformer, plenty of room inside the box for whatever modifications anyone might want). I removed it from its trashed combo cab and installed it in a pine headshell, with an extra handle on the side, making it very easy to carry. Total cost was @USD 500. Perfect for all sorts of music.
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hey i am not offended at all, and I find it hard to disagree. However, if people need a light amp that is their beater and want a TM Fender that is fine by me, but getting rid of tube amps altogether is a bad idea. People should have choices no? In any case, I was thinking more of young people who are already used to dumping their cell phones every year or two. That is why I practically gave away my tube amp to a friend's son. He loves it, and well listen I am no saint. I get to research and purchase a better Fender tube amp Originally Posted by DawgBone
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So I’m 67 and have gigged proffesionally since 1976. I’ve been through so many amps I’ve lost count. That includes all of the major brands Fender,Marshall,Ampeg, Hiwatt, Mesa Boogie,and even boutique ones like Dumble OD Special, and copies of them.
Back in those days pre 2000. Technology had not evolved to the point to actually go toe to toe with the warmth of tube amps.
In recent times Quilter and other designers have imo not only caught up with but have surpassed the limits of last century tube offerings.
Gone are the heavy transformers,dependence on wall voltage,tube batch quality,and basic upkeep of maintenance.
For me the Clean Headroom tone is the most important thing. Pedals have advanced to the point of replacing the need for an amp to distort as well.
Different boosts like the Xotic Sweet Boost, RC Boost,Luxury Drive also add warmth to the amps tone as well.
Speakers have evolved as well, and are much more efficient along with light weight enclosures. So all in all the choices are amazingly good imo. The only real issue is the gigs that actually pay $ are becoming fewer,and people can’t make even a livable wage any longer. But it was always a gamble even back then,Lol!
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They should have choices I just think finances and convenience cause or force them to make the wrong ones more and more often. Here is something comparable: Originally Posted by Harry_Barnes
hey i am not offended at all, and I find it hard to disagree. However, if people need a light amp that is their beater and want a TM Fender that is fine by me, but getting rid of tube amps altogether is a bad idea. People should have choices no? In any case, I was thinking more of young people who are already used to dumping their cell phones every year or two. That is why I practically gave away my tube amp to a friend's son. He loves it, and well listen I am no saint. I get to research and purchase a better Fender tube amp
I don't have a license but I sometimes enjoy listening to cb and ham radio. I've noticed, especially in ham, that starting about 20-25 years ago the boat anchor tube amp radios started to become giveaways. Dad retires, dies, and the radios sit and decrode or are liquidated. There are many of them out there for cheap (like some of the big Fenders and other weighty combos) but no one wants the space hogging nature, the weight, and the routine maintenance required. It's easier to buy a throwaway radio, one only the factory/maker can fix/service meaning, replace or tell you get f'ed. Yet you won't find the latest digital radio equipment with that sweet, warm sound. It's all convenience oriented now. And of course the radios are much more compact. So only tech savvy enthusiasts or guys with deep pockets, or enthusiasts that know a great tech, will bother owning the old tube models. No new tube units have been produced since maybe the late 70s so it's officially dead.
I expect tube amps from manufacturers to be mostly or completely dead in ten to twenty years in terms of new models, save for maybe the very highest end of the maker's price ranges and even at that they will be repros of classics, not anything cool and new. The small makers will mostly die off either physically or financially. It's too much money for custom tube amps so the market share there is too tiny.
Anyhow that's my prediction kinda coming true before my eyes. So much has changed....
Happy sunday and merry Christmas to you Harry, very nice talking!
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Here’s probably the best deal on an incredibly versatile amp,including effects that actually sounds great. Can cover almost any style and pretty lightweight as well
BOSS - KATANA ARTIST GEN 3 | Guitar Amplifier
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