Fender vs. boutique amps for jazz

[rschwa9966]

Lots of threads here on amps, with high praise for Fender Twins, Deluxe Reverbs, Princetons, etc. Also lots of good things said about Henriksens, Evans, etc.
I'm looking for a warm, Joe Pass/Kenny Burrell, smoky, late-night jazz club sound .
I am not a performer, so volume is not terribly important.
I currently have a Super Champ XD, which is pretty good but brings up a nasal sound in the lower trebles with all my guitars (I brought up the subject in a separate thread a couple months ago). I'd like the amp to work well with both a Gibson ES-175 and my teles.
Yes, lots of amp threads here, but I'm just asking a single broad question: Fender vs. boutiques. Thanks!

[helios]

Lots of threads here on amps, with high praise for Fender Twins, Deluxe Reverbs, Princetons, etc. Also lots of good things said about Henriksens, Evans, etc.
I'm looking for a warm, Joe Pass/Kenny Burrell, smoky, late-night jazz club sound .
I am not a performer, so volume is not terribly important.
I currently have a Super Champ XD, which is pretty good but brings up a nasal sound in the lower trebles with all my guitars (I brought up the subject in a separate thread a couple months ago). I'd like the amp to work well with both a Gibson ES-175 and my teles.
Yes, lots of amp threads here, but I'm just asking a single broad question: Fender vs. boutiques. Thanks!

How about an amp that does everything well? Cheers, Jeff


Mesa Boogie Transatlantic TA-30 Guitar Amplifier

[Klatu]

There aren't any clean jazz samples on their website. What sort of headroom does this amp have?

[helios]

There aren't any clean jazz samples on their website. What sort of headroom does this amp have?

Hello,
My post was a bit overzelaous, as I don't own a Meas TA-30 (I just would like to have one). I have an older Mesa Nomad four EL-84 (like the TA-30) and it lacks lots of headroom, but gets nice low to mid volume clean tones. Here is the clean TA-30 clip from the Mesa site:

[Vihar]

I currently have a Super Champ XD, which is pretty good but brings up a nasal sound in the lower trebles with all my guitars (I brought up the subject in a separate thread a couple months ago).

It is most probably that smallish open backed cab with the small speaker, AND the way Fender amps generally sound.

If you would like a tube amp with the same wattage but different tone, it might be worth to check out the VOX AC15.

[spiral]

Fender amps are just fine. PCB vs. handwired thing is a dumb reason to buy an amp. Many boutique makers copy Fender designs anyhow: there are dozens of Deluxe Reverb and Princeton clones out there. That being said, the boutique amps are sometimes built better since they are made by hand, and often have better components like transformers, but i don't think the tone is $1000+ better in most cases. I owned a Swart and a Carr Rambler, and i thought, "Oh. This sounds like a Fender amp (at twice the price)."

If you stick to the classics like the Deluxe Reverb, or Princeton, you won't regret it. The Princeton Reverb reissue is fantastic. The Deluxe Reverb is great as well... pretty close to the orginal. I recently played a Blues Junior III and was really impressed. They put the reverb signal before the volume, so now the idle noise level is amazingly low. I thought it sounded good. Some of the little amps like the Super Champ XD get big raves too, but i've never played one. It is a small cab, so that might be part of the reason you are getting a nasal sound.

Despite my rantings, i actually did just buy a boutique amp kit, the Allen Sweet Spot, only because it was within $100 of a Deluxe Reverb (less so if i had bought a used DR) because Allen had a 15% off sale, and i am assembling it myself. If it weren't for that, i would have gotten a DRRI.

How about an amp that does everything well? Cheers, Jeff

Mesa Boogie Transatlantic TA-30 Guitar Amplifier

Keep in mind the TA-30 is 47lbs--not really for intimate gatherings. The idle noise alone turned me off for this amp. Wish they made a 10w or 20w version w/ reverb.

[kamlapati]

I have an Allen Accomplice, a handwired Fender '57 Twin, a real '65 Bandmaster, and a '00 Deluxe Reverb RI. I end up using the Deluxe Reverb more than all the others put together. It has the right balance of tone and portability. Agree with much of the above... $1k extra for an "boutique" amp? Not obvious that it's worth it.

[jazzbow]

Anyone try one of these?

Traynor YGL1, 15 watts + reverb
Traynor Amps: All Tube Guitar Combos

I am looking to off load some geetars and stuff and am looking to buy a Traynor vave amp as they are more bang for your buck. Anyone try one ????

[D'Aquisto Fan]

My advice... buy a vintage Fender amp like a blackface Deluxe Reverb, Princeton Reverb, Vibrolux Reverb, etc. Great tone and it's an "investment" to some degree. At least it shouldn't go down in value the way reissues and most boutique amps will. Find a vintage store near you and play a bunch of models. Have fun with the whole process and pick the amp that works best for you.

[kawa]

Lots of threads here on amps, with high praise for Fender Twins, Deluxe Reverbs, Princetons, etc. Also lots of good things said about Henriksens, Evans, etc.
I'm looking for a warm, Joe Pass/Kenny Burrell, smoky, late-night jazz club sound .
I am not a performer, so volume is not terribly important.
I currently have a Super Champ XD, which is pretty good but brings up a nasal sound in the lower trebles with all my guitars (I brought up the subject in a separate thread a couple months ago). I'd like the amp to work well with both a Gibson ES-175 and my teles.
Yes, lots of amp threads here, but I'm just asking a single broad question: Fender vs. boutiques. Thanks!

‪fender super champ xd jazz guitar‬‏ - YouTube

You don't need a new amp.
Try to change the settings or replaciing the speaker unit.

ES-175D ? ;
V7～8
T10～as scenes

Champ XD ;
T1～2
B3.5

Speaker ;
Eminence Copperhead

The speaker on the guitar amp is one of the most important parts of a setup.

[Archie]

Anyone try one of these?

Traynor YGL1, 15 watts + reverb
Traynor Amps: All Tube Guitar Combos

I am looking to off load some geetars and stuff and am looking to buy a Traynor vave amp as they are more bang for your buck. Anyone try one ????

I had one of those brand new back in 1968. Very good clean sound, nice reverb, but not very loud. The originals had very cheap speakers, though, and the Celestions in the new ones are probably much better..

Traynors have a reputation for being very solidly built. I took several Traynor amps on the road (Bassmaster Mark II, Custom Special) and never had a problem with any of them.

I don't know about "more bang for the buck". The last time I looked, the Guitar Mate reissue was about the same price as a Fender Princeton or Deluxe. I'd say it's in the same class as a Princeton (I currently have a Princeton Reverb reissue), but it has a different sound. The Traynor cabinet is a lot bigger, it's closed back instead of open back, and it uses EL84 instead of 6V6 tubes. I'd be very interested in comparing a Guitar Mate to a Princeton side-by-side, but I've never seen a Traynor on this side of the Atlantic.

edit - I just listened to the sound clips on the Traynor site. That amp sounds nothing like my old one did. It sounds very much like a Vox AC-15.

[jorgemg1984]

The speaker is important but if you have a problem on the lower trebles than can be easily changed - just go to a good tech (a guy that knows a lot about mods not a guy that does good repairs). Usually its very cheap to make those mods and any problem can be solved, voicing a Fender amp is usually very easy.

[BrightSizeLife28]

I'm looking for a warm, Joe Pass/Kenny Burrell, smoky, late-night jazz club sound .
I am not a performer, so volume is not terribly important.

It sound like you want a tube amp. And low volume if you're playing at home (unless you want to annoy your neighbours). I have a Swart AST pro, and it's plenty loud (even for gigs) at 20 watts. Twins are VERY big /loud (from experience).
That being said, I get a great warm jazz tone from my Evans JE200. You can plug any guitar in and make it sound 'jazzy' (IMHO). Less maintenance than a tube amp too...

[IbanezAS100]

Anyone try one of these?

Traynor YGL1, 15 watts + reverb
Traynor Amps: All Tube Guitar Combos

I am looking to off load some geetars and stuff and am looking to buy a Traynor vave amp as they are more bang for your buck. Anyone try one ????

I would recommend a vintage YGM3.They can be had dirt cheap (I got mine for £150-last year that is, not in 1973) and with a few simple tweaks and a better speaker they will be a clean machine and fairly portable (approx 17-18 kgs with an Eminence Tonkerlite). Great reverb too. Not exactly 'the' Fender sound, but a great sound nevertheless.

Back on topic though and the OP's question...I too would recommend a Princeton, played one recently and I'm thinking of swapping my Henriksen for one. There's something about that Fender sound that's hard to beat...

Just another option...for maximum versatility and light weight, I would try a Koch Studiotone. Very sweet sound with an ES175...

Best of luck

[Archie]

Sorry jazzbow, I made a mistake. The YGL-1 is not the same as the YGM-3. The YGM-3 is a reissue of the old 60s Guitar Mate (but the new one still has a better speaker than the old ones). The YGL-1 is a different amp entirely, with a master volume, an effects loop, digital instead of spring reverb, and an open back cabinet. It just looks the same.

[monkmiles]

I have a Princeton Reverb Reissue and a Super Champ XD. I really enjoy them both. The PRRI sounds better, but the SCXD is very good too and I end up using it alot because of how light and grab and go it is. I have a 12" speaker in my PRRI. It's a really sensitive/efficient one (Eminence Lil Texas), which helps increase its volume and headroom some. So it's louder than a stock PRRI with it's 10" non-efficient speaker.

I'm actually considering another Fender for higher volume situations (Twin Reverb, Vibrolux, etc).

[jbear]

I am surprised at how much I dig the SCXD. I pretty much keep to the clean channel,and I put an Eminence Delta Demon in it. That smoothed out the treble. It's limited as far as volume goes but it has tone potential. I've looked at some aftermarket cabs that allow a 12" or even a 15" speaker but I haven't gone that route yet. I think I have too many amps as it is, but if you have one already, it is worth messing with to get it right.

[Loobs]

I for one, can only stomach playing a tube amp, even for jazz guitar. I've played through AI Clarus and Henrikksen (sp?) but they always sound extremely dull and flat to me, and to be honest....really not very good. I like the character and sparkle of a tube amp. You can always turn the treble down.

[monkmiles]

I for one, can only stomach playing a tube amp, even for jazz guitar. I've played through AI Clarus and Henrikksen (sp?) but they always sound extremely dull and flat to me, and to be honest....really not very good. I like the character and sparkle of a tube amp. You can always turn the treble down.

I have to agree that tube amps just sound a lot better. Not in every case though. There are good and bad of each. But given a choice, I would generally prefer a tube fender clean to anything.

[Olric]

I'm a bit surprised about the problem you have with the SCXD. I use one for rehearsals and small gigs, and never noticed any nasal sound with my guitars (mainly an ES175 Greco copy). Channel 1 is really great, and on channel two preset 15 gives you some nice smoky tones out of the box, but the headroom is more limited with that tone though.

[Mark James]

What about VSA amps? They are worth checking out.

[jorgemg1984]

Have you ever tried one? Are they worth the money?

[monkmiles]

I'm a bit surprised about the problem you have with the SCXD. I use one for rehearsals and small gigs, and never noticed any nasal sound with my guitars (mainly an ES175 Greco copy). Channel 1 is really great, and on channel two preset 15 gives you some nice smoky tones out of the box, but the headroom is more limited with that tone though.

It's surprising to me as well. Between the clean channel (which is a blackface clean) and the jazz king voice on channel 2, you should be able to tweak a jazz tone you like on the SCXD. I have one and use channel 1 and have been very happy as a grab and go amp that I've now used on countless restaurant jazz gigs. I've toyed with the tweed voice and the jazz king voice and have liked those alot too...but I usually settle on the blackface voice (channel 1 and voice 4 on channel 2) for jazz. I think at this point, Fender has at least one winner in the VM/XD models. I haven't tried their Deluxe VM or Bandmaster VM.

[JOYCEfromNS]

For what you describe you might seriously consider a Carr Mercury or Mini Mercury

[barrymclark]

I'd actually like to put my hands on a TA-30. It would be great at a lot of things it seems.