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Heard a lot of good folks on this site talk warmheartedly about flatwound strings, so I was very exited to try them out on my tele. But what a dissapointment. To me it's pretty much exactly the same as playing with strings that are too old and need changing URGENTLY.
That's about it. No tone. No sustain. Nothing. Just a dead string. I don't get it at all ?! Can't wait to get some roundwounds back on it again. And these things cost me like 25 bucks as opposed to "normal" roundwounds that can be had for less than 10 bucks even here.
It was worth a try though so no hard feelings here. Just saying...
Last edited by aniss1001; 02-11-2012 at 02:07 AM.
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02-11-2012 02:04 AM
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Semi/half/polished rounds retain some of the sparkle of rounds while eliminating some of the squeak. The Sadowsky Jimmy Bruno polished rounds are very good imo.
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I have to admit, I insisted on using flatwounds at first and for awhile. However, one guitar I bought had been strung with Jazz Light rounds, and I immediately took to them. For me, they were just more comfortable to play (less tension), and had a broader dynamic range.
I can still darken the tone by adjusting my technique in both hands.
For now It's unlikely I'll go back.
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Never liked flats on my tele (but on archtops i do!) and had the same "eeek that needs to go" feeling after i tried. A good compromise In my opinion are pure nickel roundwounds. GHS boomers or pyramid pure nickel or d'Addario pure nickel strings are all cheap and sound good IMHO. They give more warmth and take a bit of bite from the tele. Perhaps even jazzier are the Thomastik Infeld Bebop strings. But they are expensive and might perhaps not that easy to find.
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What brand did you use? The very greatly from brand to brand. Thomastik and Labella are both different from most other flats, to the point of warranting consideration before you dismiss them all. The qualities you list and miss are not as notably absent in these strings; the windings are the key. They might not be right for you either but they deserve a try.
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Apart from differencies between brands, flatwounds with stainless steel wraps generally are brighter and more twangy (more round wound like) than flatwounds with nickel wrap. An example of stainless steel flatwounds are D'Aaddario Chromes.
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Originally Posted by aniss1001
Heard a lot of good folks on this site talk warmheartedly about flatwound strings, so I was very exited to try them out on my tele. But what a dissapointment. To me it's pretty much exactly the same as playing with strings that are too old and need changing URGENTLY.
That's about it. No tone. No sustain. Nothing. Just a dead string. I don't get it at all ?! Can't wait to get some roundwounds back on it again. And these things cost me like 25 bucks as opposed to "normal" roundwounds that can be had for less than 10 bucks even here.
It was worth a try though so no hard feelings here. Just saying...
Sorry for you bad experience, but that's a good way to learn, isn't it?
Since you seem to like Scofield a lot, I guess the flat is not the right way to go.
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Well people have a very different conception of what a "jazz tone" is here on the forum - so you always have to be careful when reading reviews. What you call a "dead string" is actually what some people really want as a "jazz tone". Lots of great players use and love flats - Jim Hall comes to mind.
As it was already pointed out the discussion is not just flats vs rounds - strings sound and feel diferently just by changing brand. Personally I have tried TONS of strings (rounds, flats, several brands, several gauges) and picks my whole life until I settled. It's an easy and cheap way to achieve your desired tone - I don't have the money to try pickups, speakers or amps all the time. To me flats tend to sound "dead" as you said and also muddy on chords... Rounds are much more alive and the highs are more natural without being piercing (and sound much louder acoustically on an archtop).
Some flats sound more "dead" than others. Personally I used Chromes for a while and learned to hate them... Thomastiks are fine but too acoustic and thin for my taste (and too expensive also). I learned to love John Pearse Pure Nickel for my arhctop and La Bella Jazz Rounds for my 335. When i buy another archtop I am going the P90 and flats route jusr for diversity, probably La Bella Flats.
Keep trying man, you will get there (I am still trying with my acoustics, John Pearse Pure Nickel and La Bella Golden Alloy will be the next candidates)
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I actually like flats on my tele, and any guitar I use as primarily an "electric" guitar.
They don't have to sound dead and dark.
Being that you're a big sco fan and have posted about liking a distorted tone for jazz, I wonder what you thought you'd gain from going flatwound? But hey, cheap experiment, and now you know they're not for you.
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I think flats also vary a lot from brand to brand. What gauge did you use? I am not a fan of string squeek so round wounds are not an option for me. I did use some halfwound 12s on my Gretsch when I first got it. I love my GHS Pat Martino strings on my M75(a LP type guitar with a chambered body).
To each there own. BUT don't rule out all flatwounds try Labella strings and you will NOT be disappointed. Flats or rounds they are superior strings.
'Mike
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+1 Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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I have flats on my archtop and rounds on my Tele.
If you want flats, try these-
If your prefer rounds, try these -
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Roosto, how do the TI Swing string compare to the TI Bebop in terms of sound?
I've been using TI Bebop's for a long time now because they give a bright edge without sacrificing the woody, warm archtop tone and I'm curious to hear how the Swing strings compare.
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The TI round wound Bebops are THE BEST! I just ordered two more sets (14-55). Originally Posted by AmundLauritzen
I feel they give the best dynamic sound--I hate flats, they kill what little sustain the guitar has, and make it sound dead in the water.. They cost a bit more, but whatever.
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OK! The flats I'm using are these (see attached foto).
Why did I choose these?
Well the only flats that are readily available in this country it seems are the Chromes and I heard a lot of people on this forum say that they didn't like them. Besides when I was in Buenos Aires lately I thought I would try something that I can't buy here in Cordoba (here there is NO other choice but the Chromes period).
Even in Buenos Aires it was hard to find flats. Pure nickel strings even harder. And generally finding ANY strings thicker than .011 can be quite a project. This is very much ROCK territory.
Well one of the things I WAS hoping for was actually a DARKER sound. Perhaps a bit rounder. And maybe give my tele a touch of semi-hollow sound. Or atleast mellow it out a bit. I dunno compesate a bit for the "twangyness" of the tele. But to me they just sound dead like old strings. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
And I'd rather say that I like some GAIN for a general jazz sound. DISTORTED occasionally.
Unless off course you'd call a distorted sound? Pretty much my ideal jazz sound (besides being one of my favorite tunes / albums).
For a more distorted sound I would mention as my ideal. No more than that.
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I have to order anything online - I even have to order from US because I can't find alll the strings I like in Europe. Too bad importing is so tough in Argentina. I never tried Fender strings... I think you must give other flats a try if you want - but I don't think flat strings are a good choice for Scofiled's sound (clean or distorted). You have to find another way to mellow your tele...
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I'm looking for more of a Grant Green type sound out of my ES-335. I currently use D'Addario nickle round wound 11s with a wound third, which are great strings, but brighter than I want. I put on some D'Addario Chrome flat wound 11s and didn't get the warmth and "deadness" that I was aiming for, plus because the tension was higher, I got more neck bow, and I was honestly too lazy to re-do the set-up. I took them off immediately and went back to the former set. I have some T-I Swing flatwound 11s ($30 a set) that I'm going to be putting on when the round wounds need to be replaced. For the price. I'll leave them on no matter what, and since the tension is the same, no set-up should be required.
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I find Grant has a raspiness to his tone (at least on Green Street and Born to be blue). I can get partway there using dunlop gatorgrip picks or a Lollar pick made from vulcanized fibreboard.
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Yeah, and his P-90s are also probably a big par of his sound. I just tried out some Jazz tone 205 picks that, to me, are even brighter than the red Jazz IIIs that I usually use. I'll look for those picks. Thanks for the tip.
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I'm surprised it's like that in Europe. Atleast in Denmark jazz is something VERY common that lots of people play. Unlike here where jazz is something you laugh at rather than listen to. Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
Rock is the big thing here. Especially "rock nacional" (argentinean rock) which I would describe as a mix of ACDC and Eurovision song contest with a touch of iron maiden. Haha something like that. Very 80s. But you have probably heard it).
Also they seem to like oldschool rock'n'roll, rockabilly and stuff like that.
Ah and yes I am working on mellowing out the tele as you say. Quite a bit. As you know I just replaced the neck pup with a PAF. Supposedly a VERY dark pickup. And yes it has way more lows but also more highs it seems. Just more of everything. And I guess I will be able to use the filter (=tone) knob on the RAT for this purpose. I believe that Sco plays with his guitar tone knob at max (sometimes bridge pup), uses common (not nickel) roundwounds and uses the RAT filter knob to get a darker sound. I dunno..Last edited by aniss1001; 02-11-2012 at 02:55 PM.
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I just put Thomastik-Infeld George Benson 12-53 on my acoustic archtop.
They were expensive, but I like them a lot.
This is my list in order of preference:
1) Thomastik-Infeld GB
2) D'Addario Chromes
3) Rotosound
4) LaBella
LaBella sound really dead to my ears.
I also tried flatwounds on my Tele.
I put them in the morning and removed in the evening.
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Keep the flats and change the guitar!
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Not an option. At this point I'd love to throw my tele in the dumpster and buy a semi-hollow but I can't afford it... Originally Posted by Pierrot
Keep the flats and change the guitar!
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Here most people also play rock and allmost all shops are rock-oriented. I am using John Pearse and La Bella strings and I also need some custom single strings - juststrings.com is the only place on the web that has everything I want. Originally Posted by aniss1001
I'm surprised it's like that in Europe. Atleast in Denmark jazz is something VERY common that lots of people play. Unlike here where jazz is something you laugh at rather than listen to.
Rock is the big thing here. Especially "rock nacional" (argentinean rock) which I would describe as a mix of ACDC and Eurovision song contest with a touch of iron maiden. Haha something like that. Very 80s. But you have probably heard it).
Also they seem to like oldschool rock'n'roll, rockabilly and stuff like that.
Ah and yes I am working on mellowing out the tele as you say. Quite a bit. As you know I just replaced the neck pup with a PAF. Supposedly a VERY dark pickup. And yes it has way more lows but also more highs it seems. Just more of everything. And I guess I will be able to use the filter (=tone) knob on the RAT for this purpose. I believe that Sco plays with his guitar tone knob at max (sometimes bridge pup), uses common (not nickel) roundwounds and uses the RAT filter knob to get a darker sound. I dunno..
Humbuckers can be a little unbalanced some times... But they still are the best pickups for jazz imo. The filter knob can shape your sound a little but it's not exactly powerfull... and it won't change your clean tone. For that matter you need some EQ pedal
Sco's sound to me is typical 335, Boogie and RAT with a very light picking and lots of legatto (I guess volume and tone maxes out). He is very expressive in a "voice like" way,that is probably the hardest part to get...
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It seems to me that juststrings.com is very expensive as far as shipping. Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
I ordered from Lord of the Strings
I didn't pay for shipping because the order was over 30 euros.
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Raney and Abersold, great interview.
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