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What year (roughly) did he start playing his 175?
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10-02-2023 09:02 PM
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63 iirc
Originally Posted by Archie
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I read an interview somewhere where he said someone left his first 175 on his doorstep (?) after hearing 'Sounds of Synanon'. Originally Posted by wintermoon
(They made the record using Synanon's gear)
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What I heard is that a guy heard him play and thought he needed the 175 and gave it to Joe as a birthday present. there are quite a few stories about how Joe Pass got his ES175. Legendary players generate lots of... legends! Originally Posted by dot75
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BTW here is a picture of Joe playing the 175 with tape over the Gibson logo
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I've seen tape over headstock logos more than once. Howard Alden played a Sadowsky for awhile with tape over the logo, probably because he was a Benedetto endorsee. The Sadowsky didn't last that long, though. It's easier with some instruments than with others. Benny Goodman was endorsed by Selmer, IIRC (I don't have time to look it up right now) but played something else. Very hard to tell the brand of clarinet from a distance.
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That's a two-pickup version, so not the custom made one he played in his last couple of years. My guess would be that picture came from the era of the Ibanez endorsement? Originally Posted by lawson-stone
BTW here is a picture of Joe playing the 175 with tape over the Gibson logo
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I can’t see one featured on an album cover till after the mid 60’s. Originally Posted by wintermoon
A mid’ish 60’s cover has him still playing a fender.
I know the album pics aren’t always up to date.
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Joe mostly played his Jaguar... when no one was looking. Just the facts, ma'am.
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I never thought Joe concealed the logo on the custom Gibson he played at the end of his life. I've only ever heard people talking about him covering the logo on his 60's ES175, probably related to an endorsement. I'm not aware that Joe ever had any dispute with Gibson, unlike Barney Kessel. Originally Posted by John A.
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That's not a Jaguar. It's a Bass VI. Originally Posted by SandChannel
Joe mostly played his Jaguar... when no one was looking. Just the facts, ma'am.
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The first appearance of the Epi Joe Pass was in the 1991 catalog. I think the same guitar (more or less) was already in the Epi line-up prior to that. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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Yes it was just the Emperor or maybe Emperor II. Took the name of a classic world-rated guitar and applied it to a smaller factory built model, but one that was surprisingly good and consistently punches above its class in my opinion. A lot of guitar for a lot less money than some might expect. Originally Posted by va3ux
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I honestly think Joe Pass could play the Kazoo, and still make it sound like a guitar.
I've only recently found him, and cannot get enough of his sound. Good post guys, interesting to a new player like me.
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I just modded my JP-20 and I'm delighted with the result.
I've been playing around for a while with floating pickups and it all started with the wreck of a washburn J6 I bought and installed a single Gibson 57 reissue hamburger at lack position.
Later I acquired a goodin fifth Avenue cutaway with the two P90 pickups (bad choice for me) so I took off the P90's and modified a 57 Gibson reissue humpback simply by snapping off the two doglegs and installing it as a floater on a bracket which I made from aluminium and which was fixed to the neck. It worked really well and of course taking off the P90's releases a lot of town but it's a cherrywood guitar and has its limits. I still have the guitar but I was looking for something else so I found a Joe Pass JP 20 1989 for a decent price in Lyon France. It is in really good condition although there could be some fretwork and neck adjustment which I got to yet.
The point is if you are assessing a guitar it's a personal thing and you don't want to generalise or put words into other people's mouths so I speak for myself.
Regarding the comments going around about the thinness of the Tone it it all depends what you do with the guitar. If you play on stage with a full-size arch top, very responsive acoustically and fitted with a floating pickup, then good luck with feedback and so on. I have found smaller guitars and also thicker varnish as on the washburn J6 and also the JP 20 give more realistic volume performance because they are more inert. With a good amplifier such as an acoustic image you got pretty much any sound you want to get and have it reliably.
So I now come to the modification that I just completed today to my JP 20 and I must say I'm pleased. I'd been thinking about it for some time and then a brainwave came to me how I could side mount the JP 20 Humbucker to the plectrum guard using some more of this lovely aluminium strip and plate which I have in stock. It's very easy to work and bend and strong enough for the purpose.
The whole pickup including its mounting ring has now been raised just enough so that it floats above the belly of the instrument and there are no attaching screws or pickup bring touching the guitar and damping or distorting it sound. I am quite astonished at the amount of tone and clarity and sustain that has been released by this operation.
I had been very critical about the neck and the fretwork which is absolutely brilliant of course but then I'm very hard to please! Some notes had strange resonances to them and I had the feeling that some frets had air underneath them (this can cause dead notes) and I could not get the homogenous attack ring and sound that I crave along with mid and low range. Since I began playing electric guitar in 1958 I have constantly searched for THE sound and I think that I may be near my goal.
This mod is completely non destructive and reversible in 1/2 an hour. There is just a small block of wood glued under the pickguard.
There remain some small tweaks but even as it is it's a wonderful improvement. I'm in the process of making a series of solo guitar jazz videos and whilst I'm an admirer of Joe forever and also highly appreciative of his teaching tips I do not copy his style or that of Jim Hall, I'm too busy following my heart which dictates my true sound in my true self.
I'll post something here very soon with pictures of the mod and also a quick soundbite until the videos are done.
Wishing you all a happy Christmas and that we all be kind and gentle with each other, the best present that I could hope for!
Alan
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another take on the JP 20 - apologies if it has already been posted here - does not sound too shabby to me:
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Joe's story was that while he was at Synanon, he did not own a guitar. Synanon had a Fender solidbody which he was using for gigs (there are videos and the record Sounds of Synanon). A guy named Mike Peak saw Joe at a gig with the Fender and thought that someone of his talent should have a "proper" guitar, so he bought an ES-175 and delivered it to Synanon, where Joe found it on his bed when he came home. Dunno how true the story is, but it's a good one. That was Joe's main guitar for years and I have read that it was in John Pisano's possession after Joe passed away. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Last edited by Cunamara; 05-24-2024 at 12:21 PM.
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Where is that 1962 ES-175 today? Originally Posted by Cunamara
Joe Pass Jr (Joe Pass' adopted son) told me that he believed John Pisano had it (and that it rightly belonged to Joe Pass Jr.). John Pisano denied having that guitar in a telephone conversation that I had with him. Now that John Pisano is dead, I feel free to reveal that a very famous jazz guitarist (I will not reveal his name) told me that John Pisano indeed had that famous guitar and had played it at John Pisano's home. I know that there was friction between Joe's last wife and Joe's adopted children at the time of Joe's death.
Perhaps the mystery surrounding this guitar will be revealed in due time. OTOH, that 175 would be worth quite a bit to a rich collector and some rich collectors lack a moral compass, so that guitar might never resurface. IMO, the saga of that guitar is a sad one.
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Stringswinger posted back in 2015 that "Two prototypes were made of this guitar. When Joe Died, his widow sent one back to Gibson (at their request, presumably in someone's private collection now) and gave the other one to John Pisano (John told me this) for safekeeping." (Joe Pass' Late-Career Custom Gibson). That's the '93 era custom being referred to, not the '62 ES-175. But I would not be surprised if the '62 ended up in John's hands, given how much he and Joe played together.
The history of inherited guitars from famous players can be pretty interesting. Duane Allman's 1958 Gibson Les Paul was walled up in Steve Morse's home studio, behind the sheetrock, for years in safekeeping for his daughter Galadriel. His other Les Paul went to Greg, who traded it to Twiggs for a car. That one became the basis for the Duane Allman replica Les Paul. Dickey Betts had Duane's Dobro.
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FWIW, yesterday was the 30th anniversary of Joe's death. Also, sadly Joe Pass Jr. passed away from cancer 12/15/23, according to Infomation
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Sorry to hear that. Joe Jr. was only 55 years old. Originally Posted by Cunamara
Play them guitars folks, it is later than you think!
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lovely sound! Originally Posted by thelostboss
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Is that a different pickup than stock? It has two adjustment screws on the bass side and modern flat black mounting screws. Originally Posted by thelostboss
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Were did Joe Pass’s D’aquisto’s go? Originally Posted by Cunamara
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I think he’s just using very heavy strings. At least 13’s. The sound is though the strings are very high tension. Originally Posted by Cunamara
Peoples idea of these guitars sounding thin is not true imo. For a start, all d’aquisto style 16” laminates sound bright. They have a thin body. I understand the pickup placement will have an effect but not one that can’t mostly be mitigated by hand position, amp settings and string choice. I play mine with 12’s and think it sounds great and I’m one for a darker bop tone.
What you get is really nice note separation and if playing in a band, a really nice position in the mix.
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