Why are Ibanez necks so much better ?

[jads57]

Carvin!

[jzucker]

Carvin!

i've played many carvins that had bad necks. They may be good when they leave the factory but they don't stay that way. Not sure why - if they're using green wood or what - but they sure don't stay "perfect" over the long haul the way ibanez does.

And regarding the single point of contact on the nuts, I learned about that from Jimmy D'Aquisto and my luthier who works on Benson's guitars does it too, but it's pretty common knowledge. You can read about it here:

http://www.lutherie.net/nuts.html

The GB10 actually has a zero-fret so it effectively has the single point of contact done by the extra fret.

[jads57]

Does Ibanez either use 3 peice necks or grahite rods in their neck construction?

[jzucker]

Does Ibanez either use 3 peice necks or grahite rods in their neck construction?

they do not use graphite rods. Doesn't carvin ?

Most of the high end ibanez guitars use 3pc necks. GB10, AS200, etc. However, the PM series uses a single pc mahogany neck. Mine is a 2001. I sold it 6 years ago to a guy in seattle (i'm from cleveland). He sold it to someone on craigslist who took the guitar with him on several cross country trips with his family. I bought it back a few months ago. Still plays perfectly!

[Jim Soloway]

I believe the entire Artcore Expressionist series and the new Artstars use 3 piece necks.

[joerg petersen]

+1 for the Ibanez made in Japan


I say the Ibanez China quality like AS153 or SF301 is quite equal to the actual US quality for Gibson CS etc.
Its still a bit raw and not made to real perfection.

My GB10's and of course the LGB300 I own top everything what's around. Necks and sizes may differ but the quality is the same high level. In material and craftsmenship.

The necks wood is perfectly cut and manufactured precisely, fretboards polished and frets leveled by the hundred. Corners and edges are without flaw.

Maybe some boutique handmade brands compare with that.

Plek (though invented by my fellow germans) cannot substitute the quality luthier in fret dressing and board finishing. have you seen todays Plek'd necks with deep cuts below and above the frets, rosewood boards with
deep grain and not even filled or sanded. selling this as custom shop models ...

Time intensive quality control and handmade set up rules. Its a tradition and mindset that comes in place, like
the outstanding player puts all his sould and heart into his practice and performance.

Its an honour to build MIJ Ibanez and to play them as well :-)

... I go back practicing ...

jp

[vejesse]

I also have a 1978 Ibanez GB 10 and it has one of best shaped necks I've played. It has some beef to it, in fact more so than any other Ibanez neck I've played. Ibanez necks usually feel flat and wide to me but the GB just feels pefect. I heard that the shape was based on the shape of some Guild guitar neck that George Benson had. I don't think those ever came with zero frets though, did they?

I really have to say that I don't think older Ibanez guitars had great fret jobs. I've owned a dozen Ibanez and Greco guitars made between 1978 and 1982 in the Fuji Gen factory. They had boards with a radius that was neither straight or compound, just sort of lumpy mess. They all needed refrets. Lots of roundover at the edge of the fingerboard as well which forces you to sand out more wood just to get past that.

I've had ok luck with Gibson actually. I have seen some rubbery necks with truss rods that didn't work well installed on some of the early Memphis made 335's, although I hear that they're better now. Maybe I'm picky but at this point when I buy a used guitar it's very seldom that I find that the frets are ok. And because leveling the frets lowers the height to a point I usually don't like, I often just refret the guitar. This allows you to level the rising tongue at the wood and really get the radius right. Plus this gives me that chance to install the excellent Evo Gold wire. If anyone hasn't checked this out yet I'd recommend it. It was to the point where I would have to refret my main guitar once a year. This EVO is so hard wearing that you just don't notice the flat spots anymore. Not a lot of choice in fretwire sizes though but the 0.090" is great for jazz.

[Hjalmiz]

The new GB Guitars are 2500euro Guitars , what exactly are u comparing them to? Ibanez artist Guitars from the 80s are built by good guys at a time when quality wood Was way cheaper. They where expensive even then.

Most new Guitars come with a dull 010 string set and a plain G . Most of the low priced ibanez come with plastic foam under the bridge. How Would that make a good set up???? All of the ibanez semis that ive tried in stores are strung with light strings. Maybe the situation is diffrent in the US and in other parts of eurupe. But in Sweden ibanez are equal to whatever brand realy in terms of set up. The out of the Box store set up allmost always suck !And how u could determin how stable they are from what u se in a store i dont get. Ive played some good low priced ibanez but to say they are Better than Gibsons is a joke to me. Some people seem to have played Gibsons entire production aparently.

There is a reason why people sell their Guitars . I dont think its because they love it and that its a perfect one ! These are the Guitars that u get on eBay. They are those messed up Gibsons that for Some reason represent the entire brand for some !! Maybe somebody in here want to trade a Gibson for a one of those 600 dollar ibanez semis ? If so im all in !!! I'll even pay for the set up to suit your taste.

The only way to ensure that the guitar is as stable as possible other than skilled work and good wood are to keep them in the factory as long as possible and do set ups over time to se what happends to it. But thats just not possible for most for obvious reasons.

My custom semi is 2 years old before it left the builders shop for this reason. Its stable as hell and perfect in set up. My two other very expensive boutique Guitars Was shiped as fast as they where dry. They have issues ! And i know guys that had problems with Guitars from just every custom builder out there.

Its not possible to ensure stability at any price range. To many variables. There are crapy guitars and good ones from every builder. Most are not set up well when they come to the store. At least where i live....

[jzucker]

I've bought over a dozen used ibanez GB and PM guitars, including one from japan. Everyone was setup perfectly. In the USA, they come setup with chrome .012 strings. I guess all those L5 guitars on ebay is because they suck too?

[Hjalmiz]

Cool , then they are imported under better conditions/agrements than the Guitars ive seen here. Maybe they are set up by the importers before they go to the stores?

Well no, not all of them. But ill bet Some of them need work .. But thats the point. Some are good and Some are bad..very expensive Guitars likely have less problems .. But im sure the second hand market has a LOT of Guitars from every brand that has issues with their necks or whatever... Ive seen My fair share atleast. Most of them im sure can be fixed.

[jzucker]

I've owned over a dozen GB10 guitars and 4 PM guitars and probably played 20 or 30 additional ones. Every single one of them played perfectly.

I think the evidence - circumstantial as it may be - is pretty overwhelming about them compared to gibson, fender, heritage, guild. At least in terms of the factory production models...

[Hjalmiz]

Ok . I dont have your experience with the newer expensive ibanez Guitars . In My experience the less expensive Guitars from ibanez are as good/bad as any. Actually the fenders are allmost always terrible set up here. The more expensive Guitars from Gibson are set up by the importer over here. But mostly in a rock guitar way. So the nut always need work for heavier strings and often a light fret work to be perfect .

[PTChristopher2]

The nut (or zero fret) is pretty important to a setup, so to follow up:

>>> And regarding the single point of contact on the nuts, I learned about that from Jimmy D'Aquisto and my luthier who works on Benson's guitars does it too, but it's pretty common knowledge.

Name drops notwithstanding, I begin to understand how you come to some of your remarkable ways of describing views.

>>> You can read about it here:

>>> http://www.lutherie.net/nuts.html

The article describes the nut slot as a parabola section (as viewed from the side), or a "horn" in 3D. There is no "single point of contact" at all. But again, I believe that I understand how you leap from the actual situation to what you describe.

The article describes the string contacting the slot over most of the nut dimension along the string length.

The parabola section (aka "horn") allows the string to exit the slot with no hard break angle at the back. This generally reduces the chances for binding.

I learned this from Kathy Lee Gifford, who was talking to Katy Perry's nail salon assistant manager, who also does "Sco's" nails. It must be right.

But back to the somewhat absurd Gibson point:

I have never noticed Gibson having any trouble at all with strings not making nut slot contact right up at the front of the nut (for best intonation). I have also never seen an Ibanez (or other Japanese factory guitar) with nuts cut as your linked (yet seemingly un-read) article describes.

[pingu]

the Ibanez Joe Pass I played had the best neck
I ever played .... I should have bought that

damn

[yebdox]

I have to go with Jack on this one. My GB10 has absolutely the best neck any of my guitars and I wish they all had the same exact neck, with the exception of my Fenders. Plus, it's rock solid in terms of stability and tuning.

Jack, you didn't get rid of the GB10 already!!?? It looked like you said your recent one "had" the best feel.

[jzucker]

I've had 12 GB10s. I currently own a '78 which is one of the best I've ever owned. The '78 had only 21 frets so the pickup placement is in a more "bassy" position and back then they were using warmer pickups that were more like the johnny smith pickup. Today's GB10 is more like a firebird pickup. Ceramic magnet and much brighter.

[yebdox]

Haven't played any older than the 90's, mine is a 2001... I love it and wouldn't mess with it, but I wouldn't mind owning one in burst, or a GB100, for fun.

[jzucker]

i've had a gb12, gb5 and a couple gb200s as well. All with perfect necks. They're doing something write or it's one HELLUVA coincidence!

[Frank67]

My 2012 GB10 had impressively perfect craftmanship and setup out of the box and a super comfortable neck. The action could be as low as I want but I don't have to have it that low. I happen to like the bright strong pickups. I am always amazed at how big of a tone comes out of that small guitar. The one thing I am not crazy about is the finish - feels a bit cheap and plasticky.

For what its worth I also have a 2010 ES 175 and love it equally well. Plays nice, sounds nice, looks nice ... IS a nice guitar. Of the three Gibsons I had (ES 175, ES 137 and Les Paul Lifeson) none was absolutely perfect and all of them needed some moderate luthier adjustments - but all are sweet, nice sounding and playing instruments wirh tons of character.

... Yet, the best of the bunch is my Heritage golden eagle :-)

[boptotheleft]

Jack . . . not sure what type of Gibsons these guys are rejecting out of hand . . but, this seems to be pretty extreme. Are you talking about brand new? I visit many well known shops and play pre owned Gibsons all the time. Lark Street, Mando Bros, The Zoo, Rivington . . . etc.. The Gibson jazz boxes I've picked up in those shops are pretty much gig ready.

+1 on that. I play (and live)in NYC..I currently alternate between a custom shop 335 and a Byrdland. other than a basic setup, I never needed to do anything on them..they both kill.

[mark105]

I have a gb10 and gb15, both are excellent players, The 15 does have the brighter & higher output pickup. I prefer the older low output. Both have great necks. Not knocking Gibson though, My 68 custom LP is great as well (but heavy as hell).

[Tyrone & Jessica Sinclair]

If it's made in USA forget it - I own a few Gibson ES175 and the neck is a piece of junk compared to Ibanez GB10.

[jzucker]

i have to say though that my '89 175 has a neck and action as low or lower than any ibanez. The difference is that it was planed and refretted about 5 years ago. Definitely didn't play this way out of the box. If you wait 20+ years and then plane and refret 'em the gibsons and heritage guitars are great. Neither play like an ibanez out of the box so I ask again, why are the high end ibanez necks so great?

And p.s. the af200 neck wasn't in the same league as the GB200 neck.

[docbop]

This pertains to the high end ibanez like the GB and PM series and specifically the japanese versions.
I've owned 15 or 16 ibanez and every single one of them played perfectly with super low action and no buzzing. With many of the american brands, the setups are usually funky and some even need a planing and refretting from the factory.

Difference in American approach to business. There was a video interview with a working in a Japanese piano factory he works on the harp of the piano. He said in Japan he gets to take as much time as necessary to make each harp can be some take longer than others, but it doesn't matter to his managers. In America it's all about hitting quotes you have to getting a set amount done daily so a piece that need more time doesn't get it. So quality versus quality mindset.

[jzucker]

also, the workers on the average gibson guitar are making minimum wage and take an 8 week course on guitar making. They are not luthiers.