Buying/Selling guitars online?

[s1track3d]

eBay, Reverb, Gbase, here, elsewhere...

It's a pretty generic question but my interest is in of course hollow and semi hollow guitars.

eBay
pros: peace of mind, buyer protection (paypal), huge marketplace, high traffic
cons: fee's, most expensive online option, not as many great deals anymore

Reverb
pros: lower fees, musician centric - just focuses on music gear
cons: no buyer/seller protection? less proven track record?

Gbase
same pro's and con's as Reverb (+fees to join?)

Here
pros: very specific market!
cons: no buyer/seller protection? (have to figure out buying/selling method)

Elsewhere?

[Stuart Elliott]

For Reverb's buyer and seller protections, here.

includes this:

If the sale is completed through Reverb's Direct Checkout payment system, Reverb will issue a refund direct to the buyer's credit card once it has been established that no other agreeable resolution has been reached with the seller.

and this, for sellers

In the event of a dispute, your account will remain in good standing so long as effort is made to reach a reasonable resolution to the situation. Sellers who are not responsive to our resolution efforts are subject to account suspension.

I don't see a statement of protections on the gbase site.

[s1track3d]

Hi Stuart, thank you! not sure how I missed that info...

[Plukky]

As far as I can see, GBase is just a shop front for dealers - statutory rights apply.

[spiral]

Plukky is right: GBase is mainly aimed at dealers or people with a big inventory. The most basic monthly subscription is $35 for up to 30 items. It may make sense for a few months if you are listing some big ticket items as they don't take a percent of your sale.

Reverb has been great for me. I've sold 4 things there. The fees aren't that much less than eBay because you are still taking a hit on PayPal, but it is still less in fees overall. You can opt to use their CC system and it is slightly cheaper than PayPal but you have to wait much longer for the money. Since you are dealing with musicians I find the process much easier. People know what they are looking for.

TGP is probably the best general place to sell musical gear and always a first choice. There is lots of traffic there and a wide range of genre / guitar-type interest.

The kind of item you are selling could also give you additional niche options. If you are selling a hollowbody or Gretsch, you can list on Gretsch-Talk or Gretsch Pages. If you are selling a t-type or solidbody TDPRI is good. Archtops / hollowbodies are great to list here. If you have a Les Paul or similar rock type guitar, Les Paul forum is good. etc. Hollowbodies and semi hollow would get interest on all the forums I listed.

I stopped putting stuff on Craigslist: people don't know what the thing is, they just want it for half of whatever the asking price is, may not show up on time (or at all), and it's mostly a huge time suck.

Forums first (free!), then Reverb (fees), then eBay (FEES) as a very last resort.

[Broyale]

Craigslist
Pros: Play the item in person, deals can be found if patient, no fees (that I am aware of), easy contact with seller/buyer

Cons: Possibility of being robbed, raped, maimed, and/or murdered, items advertised may be stolen

[Dennis D]

FWIW

Craigslist

I did sell an older Harmony through this site and the sale went fine, w/ transaction total of $325. I have also purchased items this way, and been reasonably satisfied. I have to think I probably got lucky with the guitar sale. I found a guy, he showed up on time -alone -and with money. I also think there is probably a top amount / ceiling that dictates a certain comfort level on CR. At maybe $1000 to $1500 -tops- , I'd feel reasonably comfortable as a buyer, but pretty uncomfortable as a seller. You have local / neighborhood convenience but also only local neighborhood exposure too, unless you want to venture down the road. ( Not for me ).

Reverb

I was very satisfied with the site. I only sold a vintage part, but still found the service and exposure may be as good as it gets. I needed some tech assistance several times, and they were right there to help.
I also bought a $3000. guitar through this site, and for me that's a lot of money !! Yes you do your normal due diligence, but again, I was pleasantly surprised and very satisfied.

Again MHO.

[Marty Grass]

I have sold and bought a lot on eBay and on various forums. Most transactions were good. Some were really, really bad.

I prefer to buy and sell from those I know or can meet face to face.

If you choose to do otherwise, there may be some adventures in store for you. Some of them will give you interesting stories to tell.

I'll share just one. I listed an Epiphone Chet Atkins on eBay. I showed pictures of and described the cosmetic finish issues. The highest bidder got it for $300.

I shipped it two days later from Michigan to Texas. It was delayed a single day in Oklahoma due to a tornado.

It arrived 7 days after the end of the auction. But two days before that, the buyer initiated a dispute, which locked up my PayPal account. He notified me that he wanted $100 off due to the shipping delay.

He claimed he was the manager of The Eagles and that he had a recording session with them that he needed the guitar for. It was going to arrive a day late, so the guitar was useless to him. He gave me his email address and said we should correspond that way since eBay will block our messaging soon after the transaction occurred.

I did email him that my listing said the guitar would ship within 10 days, so I shipped it very early according to that standard.

He got the guitar and reported to eBay that the guitar finish was worse than I described and that the pictures showed and that he wanted a full refund, including shipping.

He then emailed me and said that he will tie up my PayPal account as long as possible unless I give him $100. I checked his eBay feedback and saw that he's done this several times before, mostly with farm equipment.

At that time I had sold maybe 100 guitars on eBay, all with 100% good feedback. I had two others listed at the time, both pretty expensive items. He noted that it would be a shame for him to tarnish my reputation with negative feedback.

We agreed that this was extortion and settled on a $35 refund. For that money he explained how to spot other extorters. He also promised to get me back stage passes to meet the Eagles when they came to Michigan. I'm still waiting.

Some have been critical of me for not fighting the whole thing through to the end. This is the only time I had not done that. "Doing the right thing" takes up a lot of resources- time and emotion. The last one took over 15 hours of my time and three appeals through PayPal to prevail. I viewed this as spending $35 to get good feedback and to find out from him how his scams work in order to prevent further problems.

[Marty Grass]

I have made these transactions in public places where videos are recorded. One of my favorites is at my bank. I've done many at my job site. Not too long ago I drove out of state to get two archtops from a stranger. We did the transaction at a Subway sandwich shop in a booth. A couple of times I did amp transactions in a McDonald's parking lot.

I would not recommend going into a stranger's home or letting him in yours. I've had buddies say they bring a pistol to be safe. I can promise that if you ever need to use that pistol, it will be a very bad day for you. It's not worth taking even a small risk.

Craigslist
Pros: Play the item in person, deals can be found if patient, no fees (that I am aware of), easy contact with seller/buyer

Cons: Possibility of being robbed, raped, maimed, and/or murdered, items may be be stolen

[John A.]

Craigslist: I've sold one guitar, some effects, and some miscellaneous household items, and failed to sell another guitar (which I wound up selling here); I've never bought a big ticket item (not for lack of trying), but I've bought effects and other miscellany. The big downside is that it can take quite a while and multiple versions of your ad to attract serious buyers. Also any ad attracts ridiculous low-ballers ("I know your ad says $500 firm and no trades; will you take 39 cents? If not, how about a near mint spatula in trade?"), and wire fraud scammers. Sometimes it's fun to trade emails with these goofballs, but it gets a bit old. I've never had any bad vibes from people I wound up actually consummating deals with.

Ebay: I've bought one guitar. The items was exactly as described, I got it for a very good price, and the seller was good with answering questions. There was a slight hiccup with shipping -- I asked that it not be sent by USPS because our local post office is unreliable with large packages, but he sent it USPS anyway. Predictably, the package was not delivered, I spent a week trying to chase it down, and the seller was not terribly helpful. I've bought and sold various other small doodads without a hitch, but not in a couple of years.

Here: I sold one guitar. Very positive experience. The buyer was visiting my city (NYC), and stopped by to pick it up. He was a very nice guy, he tried out the guitar, we jammed a little, he liked the guitar and the price, we did the deal. He texted me later saying he was really happy with the guitar.

Maybe I'm just lucky, but overall buying and selling online to me has been easy, and a much better deal than trading with a retailer.

John

[mad dog]

I've had good luck buying through many outlets. TGP and other forums, ebay and CL. I've had successful trades on all those as well.

As a seller, I avoid Ebay. The deck is stacked against sellers. Had some good luck selling on CL, some not so. Better luck selling on various forums.

Closest I ever had had to a deal going south was a buyer disagreeing with my condition description of a tele, on TGP. Wanted a price adjustment. I told him I had described it fairly, would not bargain that way. Just return it, I'll give you back your money. He chose to keep it, which tells me all I need to know about motive.
MD

[Woody Sound]

When selling on forums, including here, what is the norm transaction process? Pay first, then ship? Ship first, then pay upon receiving the item?

Also, how about Reverb? Obviously ebay is pay first.

I have a couple of fairly expensive guitars/amps I'm getting ready to thin out, and I'm having second thoughts about the newer higher ebay fees. Even thought they have the best exposure.

[TheGrandWazoo]

Here in CT there are two FB boards for selling gear. Pros and cons to it but it s another avenue

[spiral]

When selling on forums, including here, what is the norm transaction process? Pay first, then ship? Ship first, then pay upon receiving the item?

Also, how about Reverb? Obviously ebay is pay first.

I have a couple of fairly expensive guitars/amps I'm getting ready to thin out, and I'm having second thoughts about the newer higher ebay fees. Even thought they have the best exposure.

All the same: Buyer pays via PayPal (personal or goods/services). You send item and tracking # after receiving payment.

If you can get people to pay you as "friends / family / personal / gift" there are no fees at all with PayPal. Most people understand and have no problem with it, others won't and you can either just build that into your asking price or say buyer pays 3% PayPal fees. You'll sometimes see "PPG" which is requesting payment as PayPal Gift.

It's really not hard and the transactions I've had on forums have been extremely smooth. Most people are adults and fellow musicians. The hardest part is just taking the time to write a description and put up good photos.

[Woody Sound]

It's really not hard and the transactions I've had on forums have been extremely smooth. Most people are adults and fellow musicians. The hardest part is just taking the time to write a description and put up good photos.

I have over 400 ebay transactions with a perfect 100% rating, so I just need to make the transition. Kinda hate to start over as an "unknown" seller.

[nopedals]

If you have a big $$$ archtop to sell, and can wait to get paid, consign it at archtop.com.

Even with the consignment fee, you will be money ahead. With a consignment you have no buyer contact at all. This comes from a *lot* of experience over many years.

My buying advice is that you probably have the stuff you really need; so don't buy unless it is half street and you 100% trust the seller, especially in this economy. Going somewhere with a handgun and lots of cash or an expensive guitar doesn't strike me as being a good idea.

[spiral]

I have over 400 ebay transactions with a perfect 100% rating, so I just need to make the transition. Kinda hate to start over as an "unknown" seller.

It's a little better on TGP as a new seller because you have to be a paying member to list in the classifieds. I don't ever pay attention to the person's post count when buying or selling. In fact, there are some "0 post" people that likely only buy and sell. With big ticket items it's still good to talk on the phone and I always send my phone # so people can call me / know that I am reachable. Sell a few small items to get a few iTrader ratings and you are off to the races.

[2bornot2bop]

I've bought and sold on feebay since 1997. After a 1 year archtop selling hiatus I recently sold an archtop on ebay valued at $6600, including shipping. To my surprise my 'final value fee' from feebay was $610...I called to verify that was accurate and of course feebay informs me they had a new fee increase in November of a flat 10%.

Combined with a $277 paypal fee, as ebay owns paypal too, my total charges were $887.

So, I've sold my last guitar on feebay. Reverb seems hit and miss...I've sold 4 or 5 there, but not anything above $5k.
Gbase seems the way to go...although I'm wondering if there's enough exposure there.

[Sam Sherry]

Quinn The Eskimo's Foolproof Method of Avoiding Disputes: Quinn is EBay's master saxophone seller. No horn ever appears without at least twenty pics.

Take pics with no strings showing each fret. Take pics of the back of the neck. Show that the binding is even on both sides of the fingerboard. Show that the headstock is not cracked. Show that there's a slight ring from prior ferrules and extra holes from prior tuners.

Show each ding, each number and each flaw in detail. If you're selling an antique show the bottom of the pickup and show the date-code on the pots. Show the top and bottom of the case, show each flaw in the case and show the guitar in the case.

You don't need to post all those pics -- "Please carefully review 27 photographs in my Photobucket" is fine. You don't need to describe all those flaws textually. I use text to sell and photos to inform.

"But," you may say, "if people can clearly see all that stuff, doesn't it depress bidding?" Hmmm . . .

[Greentone]

I have, as many here also have, transacted guitar business via eBay, Reverb, and through this forum.

My favorite deal was purchasing a Heritage Super Eagle from Patrick2 of this forum. We met in person at a half-way point. It was a thoroughly pleasant experience (I also got to meet Patrick's lovely wife.) The guitar was exactly as Patrick had described, and he brought along another instrument for me to consider, in case I didn't like the first one. Patrick is a class act.

I have had years of very good experiences on eBay, but I am highly selective about what I will or won't buy. With suitable questioning of sellers prior to the conclusion of auctions, to date I have not been surprised by instruments and amps--except in a single instance of an amp that was not operating when it arrived. [I build and repair amps, though, so I went ahead and followed through with the deal. It wasn't difficult to restore the amp to working order.]

My single Reverb.com transaction, to date, has been _very_ smooth. Lots of communications prior to the sale (a private seller). I used the check out feature. Shipment was FAST and the condition of the instrument was as new.

I haven't had problems with online purchases. I guess I have been lucky. However, I encourage people to ASK LOTS OF QUESTIONS prior to consummating a deal.

[s1track3d]

Thanks everyone for the insight and sharing your experiences.

[jzucker]

it's a crapshoot no matter where you buy from. I just bought a gibson 137 off reverb.com which arrived with a neck bow and non functioning truss rod. Took it in to my luthier to get it evaluated and told the seller I needed to send it back. We got into a big dispute about it and I had to take it to paypal and AMX who eventually sided with me and then reverb.com canceled my account so beware of buying from them.

Unfortunately, the majority of folks selling guitars don't really play well enough to know the issues that currently exist in their guitars. So, something may play just fine to a guy who plays very simple chords on blues licks but up and down the fingerboard it may have other issues that they are not aware of.

Best to get in writing that you have a 48hr eval period.

[jzucker]

and regarding gbase, it seems that 1/2 the guitars on there were sold and the sellers never update the inventory.