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OK, so I bought a Princeton Reverb '65 Reissue. Not quite the same sound, but really nice.
So now, I'm told, the thing to do is to swap out the speaker for something a bit darker....
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05-11-2015 04:02 PM
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Eminence Little Buddy is a nice warm 10" hemp coned speaker. Or you could get a baffle for a 12" speaker. I have a 12" baffle and use an Eminence Lil Texas neo speaker because it's a loud and light speaker.
Originally Posted by christianm77
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Did you try the Joyo American Sound pedal in front of your Alpha? I love that pedal with my Alpha! I think it will cover some Bassman territory too.
http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/022...g?v=1384396379Last edited by Little Jay; 05-12-2015 at 04:54 AM.
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(Congratulations on the Princeton btw, nice amp!)
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Yes. It is pretty good actually... Here is a video of me playing that set up, if you are interested: Originally Posted by Little Jay
However, now I just use an EQ pedal. Has much the same effect....
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This reinforces the suggestions I had elsewhere. Originally Posted by hallpass
TBH at the moment I am 100% happy with the single coil tones, but the humbuckers on my archtops drive the amp too much. I am told this is speaker breakup and the stock speaker is designed to do this.
I hear the Lil Buddy is cleaner and smoother... Certainly my friends PR (which is an original with a 12" hemp speaker) sounded celestial with my guitar, so I am clean to get as close to that sound as possible, without removing the Bill Frisell magic happening with my strat...Last edited by christianm77; 05-12-2015 at 06:32 PM.
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Ah, I remember now! It was actually you and that video that made me purchase the Joyo pedal :-) Originally Posted by christianm77
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Yea, if not the Lil Buddy, you could get a 12" baffle for it and put in a Cannabis Rex (for hemp cone) or the Lil Texas (for light wieght) and both of these speakers are very loud/efficient, so they extend the usefulness of PRRI in terms of volume a little. Originally Posted by christianm77
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Not the speaker unless you're turned up loud. Plug your humbucker guitars into input 2. Turn down the bass when using humbuckers. Also, you can put a 5751 into v1 which will reduce the amount of preamp gain and give more headroom for humbuckers. Originally Posted by christianm77
If you want a "warmer" sound out of your PRRI but want to keep it single coil friendly, try a Jensen C10Q which is 35watts as opposed to the stock 25watts. It'll mildly warm up the tone and breakup slightly later as well.
My 2 favorite amps are a BF Princeton and the '59 Bassman RI. If I could get a straight across trade of my TRRI for a Bassman '59 RI I'd do it in a heartbeat!
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I agree... the Twins aren't my cup of tea quite so much...
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There is nothing like a bassman but a bassman get the bassman and adjust your playing around the Bassman there's No substitute for the warm sounds of a bassman
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65 PRRI is a great amp
I put an old NOS 5751 tube in V1 and a Celestion Gold speaker in mine. Nice upgrades if you're looking for a little something extra.
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Nice choice on the PRRI. I swapped my speaker for a vintage Jensen C10n. You can
find the on eBay fairly regularly. My favorite current speaker is the Copperhead. Increased low end, but still retains the sparkle.
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You sound great -- I'm constructively jealous.
Princetons don't have the oomph for me. My #2 is an 80s hand-wired Super Champ which is, for short, a Princeton preamp with a Deluxe Reverb power section. Swapping the tired factory speaker for a modern Eminence Lil' Buddy yielded several dB to the plus AND more bottom -- it's like getting another amp without having to pay full price. I bet it will help your new Princeton noticeably.
If you're looking for a Bassman sound in a medium-sized guitar-oriented package, as noted above your cheapest option is the Hot Rod Deluxe. Build a 2x10 baffle and you should be deep into Bassman territory.
For something with more nuance (at a higher cost) check the Fender Vibrolux and Vibroverb 2x10 amps. Unfortunately the one which is most common and affordable is the "Custom Vibrolux Reverb" which is a fairly noisy unit until you run some mods. If you're really handy or a glutton for punishment build one of the Weber kits in a 2x10 box.
All of these guys make plenty o' loud -- 2x 6L6 ought to get you through any jazz gig that doesn't come with a PA.
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In a nutshell, it's not going to happen. The 5f6 Bassman sounds like it does for many reasons, but at least some of them are due to the construction and size of the cabinet/speakers.
Smaller isn't going to sound like the Bassman. The Bassman is actually sort of light, as 4x10 combo amps go. I have two of them, and they aren't too bad to transport. Nor, are they too much in an apartment.
Finally, they sound absolutely delightful.
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The "Custom" channel (ie. channel 1) on the '68 Custom Deluxe Reverb is supposed to be voiced like a Bassman. Try one out before buying. Mine sounded great tonally but had some buzzing issues so it got returned. Originally Posted by christianm77
""Custom" channel features a 50s Tweed "Bassman" tone circuit for more low mids and sooner breakup. "
?68 Custom Deluxe Reverb® | Fender Guitar Amplifiers
That doesn't really sound like "transparent" but you may dig it.
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Yeah, I've owned a '59 Bassman RI and the '68 Custom Deluxe Reverb's so-called "Bassman" channel sounds nothing like it. Whether you like that sound or not is another story, but if you're looking for the '59 sound out of the '68 you will be vastly disappointed. Originally Posted by spiral
Closer to the sound of a '59 would be a BF Vibrolux, though in truth they're not that similar. I am quite skeptical about thinking a Hot Rod Deluxe could ever come even close to a '59. They are very different beasts.
I also echo Greentone's views above as being my experience as well.
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Most simulations of the '59 Bassman are really trying to cop the sound of the Bassman going balls out, which is a great sound. However, it isn't the sound we are talking about, here. We are going for the clean, airy, warm, FULL-TONED Bassman sound of the amp before the grit kicks in. That isn't what the modelers were trying to capture. The _other_ channel on the '68 Custom Deluxe Reverb is the "clean" channel.
I suspect that most people who purchase a '59 RI are going for the ripping blues amp capabilities. Still, inside the Bassman beats the heart of the quintessential clean amp with a great, full-range tone. In no small measure it is a function of the floating baffle board, the four ten-inch alnico-magnet speakers wired in parallel at a 2-ohm load, and the long-tailed phase inverter circuit Fender used on this design. The Super Reverb Amp, for example, has a 4 x 10, 2-ohm load, but it sounds quite different. Reason? The baffle board is much thicker and isn't floating. Result? The Bassman is a much livelier design. It is such a special amp.
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Originally Posted by Longways to Go
65 PRRI is a great amp
I put an old NOS 5751 tube in V1 and a Celestion Gold speaker in mine. Nice upgrades if you're looking for a little something extra.I agree that the PRRI is a great amp and think it's a little under rated actually. Maybe we should start a separate PRRI thread. Originally Posted by Encinitastubes
Anyways, with an efficient speaker, it can be a great portable tube combo for jazz. I put a 5751 in the v1 spot and play through a 12" Eminence Lil Texas (which is 101db sensitivity) and it's pretty loud. I've also played it through a Eminence Cannabis Rex and loved it too, but it added too much weight, so I kept the Lil Texas in. When I was using 10" speakers, I mainly used the Eminence Copperhead. But it was brighter than a Lil Buddy I later acquired (and is currently in a blackfaced Bandmaster 2x10 combo cab alongside the Copperhead). But both had solid volume/sensitivity. But the Lil Texas to me had the best combo of tone, volume and weight/portability.
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This is the problem with most amp modelling stuff I have come across. On the other hand it is harder (I am told) to model a good clean tone. Originally Posted by Greentone
There's still part of my that wants the Bassman, but for practicality and also a great tone, I am very happy with the PPRI. We'll see how she copes with gigs this week...
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Christianm77 Originally Posted by Encinitastubes
I can tell you from experience ,that if you try a Mambo ,you will get rid of
your AER ,there is no comparison IMHO ,it is an excellent amp particularly
paired with an Archtop ,It is lightweight, but heavier than an AER you will
be pleasantly surprised at the difference as many here will attest. I acquired
mine on the recommendation a good friend and member of this Forum and
extremely knowledgable on these matters.
The Henriksen ER12 or ER10 are also eminently suitable amps and not overly
heavy either. I am very fortunate in owning both a Mambo and an ER12, there
are differences of course but good ones. Then of course there are Evans combos
and heads but that's another story. I feel sure other members here will offer some
good advice to you.
kind regards
SilverfoxxLast edited by silverfoxx; 05-16-2015 at 04:05 AM.
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Is that you Harry? :-) Originally Posted by silverfoxx
How does the Mambo stack up against the AER for acoustic guitars? That's the main reason I use the AER, and yes I agree that the AER doesn't really cut it for electric archtop tones. So I thought, *&%! it, I'll get a Fender (having got a car helped that decision.) :-) Full fat valve amp, with all the trimmings, none of your Henricksen nonsense (I will agree the Henricksen is a fine amp for certain tastes.)
Anyway I have no fecking money thanks to the PRRI, so any further discussion on the matter is somewhat moot for the next few months at least.
I haven't yet tried the new amp with a drummer (the test!) but in my little trio gig with a singer today, it made me a very, very happy man.Last edited by christianm77; 05-17-2015 at 02:51 PM.
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I'd recommend at least trying some of the smaller tweed-era circuits, like the 2x10" Tweed Super and the 1x10” Tweed Harvard, like those made by Victoria.
They won't sound exactly like a bassman, but they'll share some qualities, and IMO sound much better than profiles (coming from someone who uses and loves the Kemper).
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Christianm77,
No I'm not Harry, I moved on a Fender Princeton RRI as even changing
the speaker to a Ragin Cajun didn't produce the tone I prefer. I cannot
comment on Acoustic guitars through the Mambo, but reiterate it's
excellent quality for electric Archtops, it has the edge over the ER12 for
tone. If you want more output then you might want to defer back to
the Bassman ;59 RI ,when funds permit. I'm afraid they are too heavy
for old codgers like me. I use an Evans AH200 with an RE Stealth if
I need more output than the Mambo ( the Evans Head weighs nothing ,
the Stealth is approx 30 lbs only) But if you're happy with the PRRI
none of the above is relevant.
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This seems to be a common 'to do' for the 12" mod. Originally Posted by hallpass
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