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I'm trying to decide between these two as my first jazz guitar. I'm an intermediate blues player who's looking to get into jazz. I would greatly appreciate hearing from anyone who has some experience with either of these guitars. Thanks in advance for your input!
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01-09-2016 02:57 PM
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Walked into a music store a few months ago, saw a 175 premium, picked it up, plugged it in, and it adopted me on the spot. This box has THE typical jazz guitar sound. The Gibson pickups really cook! I've been a jazz guitar nut for over 50 years, owned lots of guitars, but I don't think I've had an axe that actually sounded better.
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I bet Joe Pass himself would say to go for the 175!
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I'd go with the Pass, the Epiphone 175's neck is waaaay too thin for my taste.
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I'm a happy Epi Premium 175 owner. But I wouldn't mind having a Joe Pass too if my house was bigger!
Sure it's shiny & would benefit from better pickups, but still has all the makings of a great guitar IMO.
I don't think you can go wrong either way.
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I'd make your mind up for you: Epiphone ES-175 Premium.
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Make sure you that see an ES 175 Premium in person before buying one (of course, play one too if you can). The matte finish might not be to your taste.
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I had a JP for several years--replaced the pickups, but otherwise a great versatile guitar. I have also enjoyed playing the 175 in stores--seems to be a nice jazz box at a good price.
Here are my thoughts: the 175 has a great classic jazz sound, indeed the much sought-after "thunk". If that's what you're after, you can't do better for that price than the 175. I agree the satin finish is not everyone's cup of tea. Also, the burst doesn't compare to a true Gibson burst--I like the natural much better. I can't comment on the neck, but it's a pretty comfortable guitar to play.
The JP has more bling. It is a very comfortable guitar to play, with a neck that to my hands was perfect. I don't know about the newer pickups and how they compare to the Gibson 57's in the 175, but even the stock ones in mine weren't too bad. It is probably a more versatile guitar--can do rockabilly and twangy stuff better than the 175 IMO, also I would guess less prone to feedback.
There are going to be way more JP's on the used market with much better prices than the 175. The Korean Samick models from about 2000 are really nice--I got mine for $400.
I could really go with either as a first guitar or gigging guitar. If you have to have that thunk, you probably should get the 175. If price or versatility are the main factor, I'd go for the JP.Last edited by Doctor Jeff; 01-10-2016 at 09:51 AM.
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I shouldn't muddy the waters with more suggestions, but there are two other choices right at the same $1000 price point that will compete directly with the Epi 175.
1. Peerless Gigmaster Jazz 175.
2. Eastman AR371
Both of these instruments will offer a nice taste of ES175 vibe. As I mentioned in a similar post a while ago, all three of these guitars (Epi, Peerless and Eastman) will sound different from each other.
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I'm not one for the visual thing but the "VOS" type or matte finishes are a real turn off to me.
Originally Posted by Ghostofachance
The early JP's are beautifully made, come in several color variations (cherry and tobacco burst, natural, and wine) and are at a price point most anyone can afford. The necks are just right in playability and add to that (IMO) they need next to nothing to sound and play right. OK, maybe a wood bridge and removing the JP name and gigantic "E" badges which (to me) are tacky.
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Got a 95 Samick made JP and quite like it despite the numerous mods I did over time.
Its only weakness was the pickup but that can easily be swapped for something better.
However if I was NOW on the market for a 24.75 Arch top and having just 1K, I would try a couple Epi 175 Premium.
The ones I have heard, have a pretty much convincing thunk and sound closer to the real deal than any copies including Eastmans.
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The 175 Premium has Gibson US 57 Classics. I just hate the weird placement of the F holes and how big they look compared to a Gibson 175.
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Epi 175. I has Gibson pickups and is very similar to the Gibson 175. I had a JP at one time, the Epi has a thicker body. I agree the neck could be a little thicker but I've gotten used to it. R
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I didn't think that anybody would remark on my comment about the matte finish, so allow me to expand.
Gibson has made an Epiphone 175 (the Premium) that sounds so good that it could cannibalize sales of the much more expensive Gibson 175. So what did Gibson do? They ugly-fied the Epi 175 (which already was a little big ugly, courtesy of the headstock) by giving it a matte finish.
I've seen a matte sunburst Epi 175 in person, and it looked dreadful. I've also seen the Epi 175 in flat black, and it didn't look too bad, flat black currently being a hip look. I haven't seen the 175 in natural (blonde) but I suspect that it, too, would look better than the sunburst, but still not as good as a glossy blonde. Haven't seen the wine red version so can't comment on that.
My fear with owning an Epi 175 in flat black is that it would develop a glossy patch where your arm rests on it.
As an aside, I wonder about the future of the Epi 175. Gibson says that its a "Limited Edition." Will the Epi 175 cease production in the future, only to be reincarnated in some other guise?
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According to epi. that finish is lacquer, so it can be polished to a luster with 3M compound and a machine or even by hand. Those Premiums sound great BTW
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Yes, I'm well aware that you can buff a matte finish to a gloss but I don't think that the result would be as satisfactory as a factory-applied gloss finish.
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If the matte finish is due to particulates (e.g., flattener) in the finish itself, which is likely, you'll never achieve a shiny finish with buffing.
I like the natural finish best on the 175--I would generally prefer a straight grain pattern like the close-grain spruce on the JP, but the maple looks pretty good on this one especially in person.
However, none of the woods or finishes compares to those on a Gibson 175.
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I am constantly surprised, not really surprised, because there is a lot of fussiness here, but I notice it, at how picky the guys on this forum are about the sub $1000 archtops. They are not high end guitars. They become $5-600 guitars the moment you buy them new, and they become used guitars. They are never going to be perfect, and were never meant to be.
Some of them, perhaps many, are very nice sounding and playing instruments. This probably is dependent as much on the variation between individual instruments as between brands and models.
I have had an epi 175 premium for a couple years. It is matte black because that was the color of the only one in the guitar center that day. I think I paid $699, maybe $799. It was right when they first came out and it was priced lower than they usually are now.
I don't like the thin neck, but can live with it, because the guitar sounds really good, just like a 175 is supposed to. I have had a fair number of cheap archtops over the years, and had a '81 gibson es-175 for a few years, and an early '60's guild ce-100d for over 10 years, and the epi sounds as good as any of them.
In the under $2k price range, in my opinion, you are going to have to compromise on something, if nothing more than that you can't have what you really want. For me, if an instrument that sounds like what I want and can be made to play well is in front of me, I can compromise, a lot, on color and the details of fit and finish.
Another virtue of the epi is that they are easily found in stores (eg. Guitar Center), and therefore making it possible to actually put your hands on the actual guitar you may buy.
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FWIW, I think the Epi 175 is a nice looking guitar -- with the exception of the burst.
I have the natural & it's really very nice, though I too agree the headstock is not amazing -- but hey, there are lots of uglier headstocks out there! I'd go with Black or Maroon in a heartbeat too . . . burst, maybe not so much.
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I would buy another if they came out with a single pickup model. You never know! R
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Old thread but different consideration now that the 175 is at least currently not made but the Joe Pass is still. Hopefully they bring back the 175 as the used ones now sell for as much or more than the new ones did two years ago. These new Epiphones with improved quality and Gibson pickups are a real hit.
Other option I've seen is the Reverend Pete Anderson PA-1. Replace the bigsby with a trapeze tailpiece. The hardware and build quality on the Reverend's I've seen has been first rate considering the price.
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