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I finally took a set of calipers to my Unity today. (I purchased the calipers to measure the Musikraft neck I got for my Partscaster I recently assembled. It has a really girthy neck that I like--one-inch all the way up.)
The Unity 100th Anniversary model that Aaron Cowles made was for the founder of D'Aquisto Strings, Ted Krause. I don't know if Krause specified the big neck, or if Aaron Cowles decided to carve this one on the chunky side. All I do know is that it is THE most comfortable guitar neck I have ever played...EVER.
The nut is 1.702" like some of the '59 Reissue Gibson jazz guitars. The depth of the neck at the first fret is 0.975". At the 12th fret the depth swells to a full 1.3". The shape of the neck is a wide, full "D."
I spun around the room, playing improvised lines and comps on Changes on my different guitars. They flowed most easily and accurately on the Unity, which I attribute to the feel of the neck. Anyone else have an archtop like this?
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08-06-2016 03:00 PM
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The Gibson Bozeman L-7C certainly fits the bill for a large neck, with a 24 3/4" scale, nut width of 1.735", and a substantial depth with rolled fingerboard edges. All of the ones I have played have had big necks.
In my overall experience, lots of old Gibson and Epiphone archtops have bigger necks, but these became hard to find at the start of the 1960s. Plenty of archtops built by D'Angelico and D'Aquisto have bigger necks.
The Gibson L-5P, double-cutaway L-5CES (NAMM'14), and 17" Gibson formed-top guitars (NAMM'15) that I played at NAMM had really nice bigger necks, but I don't know if that's because they were prototypes or if they were specified that way.
None of the Gibson L-5, S-400, Legrand or Byrdland guitars I've played built in the Custom Shop from 1993 to 2013 have big necks - they have all had medium-sized necks.
Most Heritage archtops have small or medium-sized necks, except for those built with large necks at the request of customers/dealers. So very few Heritage guitars have big necks. I've passed on many, many nice Heritage archtops because their necks were too %$#@ small for me.Last edited by Hammertone; 08-18-2016 at 11:51 PM.
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Hammertone,
The 30s-40s Gibsons, Epiphones, and the D'Angelico that my first teacher had (a 40s instrument) all had pretty substantial necks--much like my Unity. I think you are correct that necks got puny in the 60s and beyond.
The L-50 I have has a deep neck, but it is somewhat disguised by the pronounced V-shape that quickly gets you to adopt a "thumb over" style (that I tend to revert to unless I am consciously thinking about all of the classical lessons I had).
One of my favorite L-5 guitars belonged to a guy who used to perform nightly in a club in Ft. Lauderdale. He sang and accompanied himself on guitar. He used an old Grimshaw (England) until a woman approached him and said, "you have the wrong guitar for your style; you need this--and produced a '38 sunburst L-5 that she gave him." (as told to me by the artist) That guitar had a GREAT sound and had a thick, round neck, as opposed to the V-neck of my Gibson of the same year. I never understood that. Different people on the different level lines carving necks, I guess. Maybe something about the difference in shaping a mahogany versus maple neck, at that time, too.
I'd love to be able to track down that L-5. It's owner has passed on now. It was a non-cutaway. It sounded simply amazing.
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My L5 CT acoustic has a quite large neck, noticeably larger than my Wes or Byrdland. I used to really get on with big necks but they have become a bit harder to play comfortably as of late. Bob
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I know a lot of folks who have had a tougher time with guitars--and especially big necks/big strings--as they (players, not guitars) age.
I used to notice my hands aching when and after I would play...but not anymore. Hmm? I must be lucky or something. I'm in my 60s now and...knock wood...even upright bass is still a lot of fun. Maybe bass (and farm chores) have kept my hands limber. Could just be 12-oz curls, though.
Let me raise a glass to everyone being able to enjoy the guitar as fully as they choose to, for as long as they wish to do so! Cheers!
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Ill drink to that!!!!
Bob
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Of my 4 Heritage guitars, 3 have the more common thinner necks while the 4th has a fatter neck than my 1940s Epiphones.
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My 22 guitars span quite a few differences regarding necks.
In a list, they are:
3 Full Modified V necks
4 Full C profiles
1 Full D Profile
4 Medium C Profiles
2 Medium D profiles
6 Thin C Profiles
2 Thin D profiles
nut sizes vary from 1 5/8 to 1 3/4 (not counting my classical or my 7 string) Scale length varies from 24 5/8 to 26 3/8.
My preference? Thin C profile, 24 5/8 scale 1 11/16 nut. Only my 1963 ES-175 fits all of that.
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Hi Hammertone I saw a Hofner Committee in a shop the other day I was gorgeous
don't know the yoear but looked 60s maybe
But the neck was effin enormous !
I'm OK with a fat neck , I play a 60s President around the house
Is that huge normal ??
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Gibson completely changed its neck shapes @1930-34, from the big V shape to a rounded C shape. Many 30's Gibson archtops have lovely medium-sized C-shaped necks. My guess is that they were exhausting their supply of obsolete mahogany neck blanks on their cheap guitars.
Originally Posted by Greentone
My impression is that they maintained this general approach, with some variations in the heft of the "C" neck, until @'60, when they started to use a "wide-flat" neck profile (still 1 11/6" at the nut), with the back of the neck noticeably flattened, making it much less deep. Not to my taste. Following that, they introduced 1 9/6" nuts, then reintroduced 1 11/16" nut, and so forth, but most of those guitars are of no interest to me.
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Hofners built between @1947 and 1960 show significant variations in its neck sizes. Originally Posted by pingu
After introducing adjustable truss rods to its necks in 1960, Hofner standardized neck shapes and sizes, more or less. Very few are huge after 1960, just pleasing large - most of these have fabulous full "C" necks IMO. You probably played a '50s Committee - I have a '57 Committee in my collection with a gigantic neck. I'll go measure it for laughs - it's crazy. Rick Kelly would be proud.
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Large necks use to be my preference. But it all depends on the width and shoulder on each carve.
Fender Type....... 1&5/8ths" I like more shoulder and first fret.90"to 12th fret 1.0"
Gibson Type..........1&11/16th" I like C or D shape .870 first fret to 12th fret 1.0"
My Elferink Tonemaster ......1&3/4" D shape .845 1st to .990 12 th fret
These are still big but very comfortable for my taste!
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I'm surprised more guitar players don't use (or mention using) a carpenters profile gauge on their necks. These things really give you an accurate idea what to look for when trying out guitars. If you found a profile you like you can copy it and search for other guitars with similar profiles. Or better yet, if you are having a guitar built giving the profile to the luthier increases your chances of getting the guitar you want.
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The neck on my '58 Hofner Senator is huge. At first I found it awkward to play, but I've grown to like it. If an older Hofner Committee acoustic showed up at the right price I would be all over it. I have a bit of a thing for Hofners.
My mid 70s Greco 175 copy which has a very slim neck, and I think a slightly bigger neck would make it more playable- at least for me. I'm still getting used to it.
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I like big neck with D profile, but U is fine, C is fine... What I really like is narrow necks, 1 5/8 is ideal. I don't understand why it's kinda hard to find archtops with narrow necks, though. Thanks God for vintage Guild guitars, but if I want a new one from modern builders, it's all 1.70 and wider that apparently most in demand. Never got that.
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Seems like the 175 1959 VOS has a very substantial neck, and yes it's easy to play, which surprised me as well.
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And the VOS 175 is 1.7" wide at the nut.
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I favor the big necks. My 2 Gibsons, both 59 VS Reissues, the ES-175 and the ES-330 both have big, girthy necks, especially the ES-330. The ES-175 is a little more tapered, but seems to get pretty damn thick closer to the body. I wouldn't mind a bit if both these guitars had 1.75 inch nut width. they are closer to the 1.68 or 1 11/16 width which is pretty good. I could not live with the 1 5/8 width. I guess that is what the folks wanted back in the mid-sixties. Gibson has ridiculously detailed specs on these new VOS guitars listed on their website, based on their CNC and PLEK measurements, but I forgot what the neck dimensions were for my guitars. Also, (although not an archt.) I bought a Warmouth neck for my strat that is not tapered, 1 inch thick right down the line. I love it. Big and chunky. I find the big ones easier to play and I like the stable feel that they provide.
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My favorite necks are on my Fender Nocaster RIs. My '59 VOS 175 is .89 at the first fret, but feels smaller because of the soft shoulders and because it doesn't increase a whole lot up the neck. My absolute favorite is my 2006 175 with P-90s, which is about .91 and the first fret and gets more substantial all the way up. I have smaller hands, but with a traditional classical position, the bigger necks are much more comfortable for me.
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Many fine old '50s German archtops have narrow necks. Happy to go through the bunkers and find one for you anytime, from Hofner, Hopf, Glassl, Lang, Roger and more. Builders and shops like these made necks in a variety of sizes, from narrow & deep to hyooge. Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
Last edited by Hammertone; 08-09-2016 at 01:12 AM.
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I like a big neck. Of the the SGs I've owned, the two Gibbys had Ds that weren't really deep enough; but I love the shoulders. The Epi I had featured a 60s neck that was great for faster rock stuff but not so much fun when bending strings. My old Les Paul, a 73, had a great, chunky neck, and my Ibby has a neck only a skosh thinner -- very pleasing to the hand, supports bends well and makes playing with classical technique a joy.
I don't own a jazzbox yet, but when I get one, it'll have a hefty neck.
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It's really impossible, or at least futile, to judge a neck by its caliper measurement alone. For me it's mostly about how much "shoulder" is left on the carve,i.e. C,D,U,V. I like anything but a V shaped neck; there's just no place to put your thumb.
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1937 Gibson L-4 - Vintage Guitars Since 1965 - Matt Umanov Guitars
....I almost got a speeding ticket on the way to checking out one of these...........broke my heart to walk away -- the neck was a baseball bat......
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Yeah that must be it ! Originally Posted by Hammertone
GIGANTIC ...... it don't need no steenkin Truss Rod neither
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DennisD,
Played 'em! Those 30s L4s and L7s (at least the small-bodied L7s) have necks you could stand at the plate with in a wood bat league game. I like them a lot. The guitars sound terrific, too. They aren't everyone's cuppa, though.
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