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Though I don't need another guitar, I've been looking for something old ever since I got rid of my '53 Fender lap steel. Just something cool about an old guitar.
I'd love an old tele but they're just out of my comfort zone price-wise. Even a decent old 175 is a bit steep. So I've been looking for a vintage Gretsch...with the DeArmond pup and no Bigsby.
This seems like the best price-to-condition ratio I've seen so far...
Vintage Original 1955 Gretsch 6190 Streamliner | Reverb
Any thoughts from people than know more than me?
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01-02-2019 04:49 PM
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I am not a Gretsch fan they to me have too many issues and not all that well built. I did a neck set on a 6120 last year and what a mess of work from the old factory. Maybe it depends on the years and where they are built but frankly there are many more choices. I would on from the older 1940's woud probaby be better. Once that started added electronics and pickups of various styles it seems to have gone downhill.
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That's interesting. Definitely something to think about. I did some fretwork on a Country Gentleman several years ago, and have done setups on a few of the newer ones, but I really don't have Gretsch guitars come through very often.
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Yea, every time I hear about a vintage Gretsch, I hear about neck reset. Or binding, or both.
The modern ones are built better, but the necks seem on a skinny side, not ideal.
But I'm a fan as far as 'That Great Gretsch Sound' goes. Sure beats Gibson to me.
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When I was in high school (ca. 79-80), a kid in school had a Gretsch Anniversary for sale that a buddy of mine and I were both interested in. So we took it to a well known vintage dealer/repair shop and asked the owner to check it out. He quickly spotted that it needed a neck reset, and told us basically to never buy a used Gretsch. The modern ones are a different story, but 50s/60s Gretsches are a often a mess, much more so than other classic brands.
John
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To reset the neck on the Gretsch I had pull out all the stops and do all sorts of crazy stuff. I even jigged the neck on the body before gluing to made sure I had the angle correct. I did get some advice from a Gretsch wizard on the East Coast New Jersey Old School Guitars. He was great with giving me the proper neck clearance at the bridge. Curt Wilson, I owe that guy a beer because Gretsch guitars just do not behave like ordinary ones. They neck angles all look way to shallow even when they are correct.
In the end this had a regular large screw holding the neck also buried under a black wood filled hole. I had to remove this and then when I went back to put the neck on I used a slightly large screw. The screw is not holding the neck set I cleaned out the pocket and had the neck glue in tight all sorts of shims to get it perfectly tight. I had to refill the hole so I just put a screw back in. The only thing I can say is the neck will not be coming off that guitar again I am sure but they should have done it correct in the first place.
Those Gretsch guitars in my mind are just beast. I do have to say those Filtertron Pickups do have a wonderful sound for some styles of playing that just cannot be had by anything else. Do they even make pickups that sound like that today? It certainly had a unique sound that I did enjoy. Sort of like the ride of huge vintage 1970's Cadillac...……..you don't have that today.
My advice on the Gretsch is play it in person and go over it with a fine tooth comb.
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I have a modern Terada made Gretsch, would love a vintage one too.
From what I've read they're a bit fragile and often need neck resets and binding work.
Would love a 50's Country Club with Dynasonics, it would be a very cool (and different!) jazz guitar.
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I'm leery of fragile vintage stuff, so maybe old Gretsch is not the best way to go. But were I to jump Gretsch, that is exactly the model I'd go for.
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anecdotally, i've heard that the reason many gretsch guitars from the 50s and 60s were a mess was that a large number of their employees had a huge drinking problem. so, lots of drunk and hung over guys working on them. funny to think about, but nobody can really confirm that now.
but yes, binding rot is almost a given, and other surprises may be in store, too. but the ones that still work (or have been fixed)- wow. nothing like them.
if you aren't set on old wood, the current ones are widely considered the best they've ever done. post 04 is the sweet spot, but i wouldn't really want something from the baldwin era through to the early/mid 90s, at least. anything older than that i can't really afford, unless it was something kinda funky like a beat up clipper or anniversary. that guitar in the first post looks pretty neat.
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So maybe it was one of those "day of the week" things that you occasionally hear about vintage Gibsons.
Originally Posted by feet
FWIW my one and only vintage Gretsch was an all-laminate acoustic archtop from the late 50s. Someone had lovingly done a neck reset and the neck was just about perfect. Great tone, just begging for a dearmond-on-a-stick. Based on that and a couple 50s anniversaries I've played I would probably jump if the price was right, especially with an original dearmond. That Streamliner looks sweet.
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Thanks for all the input. I appreciate it.
I've read that the binding rot issue is generally associated with '60s era Gretsch's, and that if a guitar has made it this long without major rot, it will probably be okay going forward as long as the instrument is left out of the case. And I'm not overly worried about binding anyway. That's relatively easy to fix if necessary.
Neck resets...well, I'd rather slam my dick in a door. I've been doing repairs professionally for 15-20 years now, and have only done about a dozen neck resets in that entire time and would be happy to never do one again. They just don't come up that often. Just often enough to remind me that I hate them and that, while they're expensive for the customer, they're still not really worth the time for the repair guy...at least in my experience.
I'd rather not buy a headache, but in my price range, I might not have much choice. Open to suggestions, though.
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Have you looked into Levin guitars? For some, the Gretsch appeal is that Dynasonic pickup. Levin also made guitars with Dynasonics and they're some of the coolest looking and sounding guitars around:
My fix was to get the most faithful Dynasonic replica I could find and stick it into a great sounding humbucker guitar.
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Don't confuse '50s Gertsch guitars with '60s Gertsch Guitars - very different animals.
Over the years I've had three '50s Streamliners (all @1955-57, in Bamboo Yellow/Jaguar Tan), each with a Dearmond 2000 ("Dynasonic") pickup, and they were fantastic guitars once I reset the necks on them.
VERY easy neck resets on these. No binding issues on any of them. The Dearmond 2000 is a great pickup (Gibson stole the design wholesale for their AlNiCo V pickup, changing only the shape of the magnet to avoid being sued by Dearmond. They did this because Les Paul insisted on using a Dearmond 2000 in the neck position of his goldtop Les Paul model, heh).
It has all the bang you'd get out of an old, single P-90 ES-175, but with a shallower body. You can put the Melita bridge in a bag and use a regular wood archtop bridge base with either a wood or Tune-o-matic top.Last edited by Hammertone; 01-03-2019 at 10:08 PM.
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FWIW, I messaged the seller, and they insist that there's no binding rot or neck issues, just normal aging and wear.
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you know enough to know if they are telling the truth, so if the return policy allows it, it may be worth a shot. there are other ways to get there, but few as cool.
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single dearmond neck pup gretsch is one of the classics!!..dynasonics are hi-fi clear...you just have to dial in your tone!!! with guitar & amp knobs
oddly, posted on the gdp around same time as op here...
good thread!
1955 Cheesecake Pin-Up
:
Vintage Gretsch Guitars :
The Gretsch Pages
cheers
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i've been trying to get on the dynasonic falcon train for years, and it never happened for me. i don't really need that sound, but i kinda want to try it out. see what's there, see what i can do with it. do keep us posted.
i know they make humbucker sized dynas now, but i'm not willing to sacrifice anything i currently have. and if i'm going to get another guitar to chase that sound, it may as well be one i want.
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Not that it helps you in any way but this thread reminded me of a one-that-got-away story. I was offered a late thirties or early forties blonde Gretsch Synchromatic with the light bulb headstock for a few hundred bucks. This was back in the mid nineties. The reason I didn't buy it was because it was literally in pieces. The body and neck were apart but there and the tailpiece and bridge were in a box. I wasn't ready for that amount of work...I'd do it now but nobody is offering.
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After playing through Dynasonics, other pickups sound muffled and choked! It's like hearing the guitar in high definition.
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Over the years owned many vintage Gretsch. Aside from an old modded Double Anniversary (a 1959 with Filtertrons and ebony board) I had a couple of Tennessean's with the closed F holes, wasn't overjoyed with the Hi Lo Trons in them and found an old cat selling Gretsch parts, got a set of Filtertrons and had my tech Dave Tupper install those. A couple years later after I'd sold everything while in Chef School I grabbed up another Tennessean that had Gibson humbuckers in it. It sounded amazing. I was on the vintage original thing and located another set of Filtertrons and had Dave install those also. The sound of the Gibson set was more pleasing to me.
Always wanted a White Falcon. An old buddy had the Gretsch Round Up (a '55 I think) the Les Paul type with the knotty pine top and G brand imprinted on it and the belt buckle tailpiece - country rock sounded real good out of that. Now I have Rhodes Scholar's old '59 Double Anniversary. If I saw the right White Falcon I'd do that just to check off that bucket list guitar.
Big
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The original ones and the historically accurate new ones made by Seymour Duncan are similar. Originally Posted by entresz
The Dynasonics that look like the originals on the outside but not the inside are....not the same.
Real Dearmond 2000 pickups:
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If you really want the skinny on Grestch, go to the Gretsch Discussion Page- tons of knowledge over there, and one of the members is also a luthier who has worked on tons of them- Curt wilson.
Here's his website, for those who may be interested... he's worked on alot of stars' guitars, Grestch and other brands...
Old School Guitar Repair, Restoration & Lutherie
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Maybe this thread will get me off the dime. I so want to hear the dynasonics in a hollowbody jazz sound. So that streamliner is quite appealing. Or, I have a pair of the Seymour Duncan "Dynobucker" pickups in hand. HB size dynasonics, supposed to be tonally the same as the well-reviewed SD custom dynas.
All I need is the right donor hollowbody with HBs. And maybe a Bigsby for non-jazz fun too.
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Afficionado I dont know, but I had a few in my past life.... all long gone tho....
All were originals, and none had binding or neck set issues BTW. The necks are rather skinny though and build quality is so so on everything
a single PU streamliner could be a great jazz guitar, similar like an ES175 with single P90. And rare to find, as most single PU gretsches were converted to two pickups over time.
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Too late ! There was one on Reverb just last week at $500. Total project. But gone now it seems. (At Imperial Vintage Guitars). They still have a 50s example for the same price also project condition. Originally Posted by jasonc
I had a lightbulb Synchro for a while, and while it was visually stunning and a good strumming rythm guitar, sound wise it is no match to a 30s/40s Epiphone or Gibson. I had expected it to be very loud with an 18” body , 26” scale and x brace it was rather quiet too.
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