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Took delivery on a James Hutchins era L-4CES on approval yesterday. The scale is 24.75" and after chugging away on a 25.5" scale it felt like I was cheating! The neck is beautifully contoured, close to a D shape. I have short fingers that are a little stubby. So, for me, 24.75" is the way to go. What became apparent to me relatively quickly was that the neck feels a little narrow. So I wanted to see if anyone knew of an "affordable" ($3,500 +/-) instrument with the specs mentioned in the title. Worst case I'll just play the L-4 and be happy with it. Or return it. Thanks! p.s. I prefer a nitro finish.
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08-23-2019 06:09 PM
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Sadowsky.
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Thanks. I saw the Jim Hall model. A little pricey for me, plus I need position markers.
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The Loar LH650 I think scores here. I think they can be found for under $1000.
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You could have a new nut made or new TOM saddles notched with wider string spacing keeping the fretboard width unmodified. These put the bass E and treble e closer to the edge of the fretboard but you may prefer the feel of wider spaced strings.
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As Lawson mentions the Loar hits all your requirements. If lower bout width is negotiable than I'd suggest a Peerless Martin Taylor at 15" lower bout, 24.6 scale and 1 3/4" nut with ample spacing at the far end. It has a more D style neck (but not fat) than say the Eastman ElRey which has a more C shaped profile.
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It's the width of the fingerboard itself. Just feel like a wider one would be more comfortable for me.
Originally Posted by Jabberwocky
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The Loar LH650VS is very affordable. They're all over the place for $650 used. I even found a nice one for $500 but no pickguard. I don't think I'd want to go below a 16" lower bout, so the Martin Taylor is out. I've read some nice comments here about the Eastman El Rey, but prefer a more traditional look. Originally Posted by rob taft
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I bought a used Bernie Lehmann Session 16 for $3,600 a year and a half ago. A very fine instrument. Not nitro, but a nice thin application of something else, which doesn't seem to have hurt the tone in the slightest. 16 inches, 1 3/4 nut, 24 3/4 scale, hand carved, fret markers, ebony appointments, floating K.A. handmade. The real thing.
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Holst!
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Yep. Originally Posted by rictroll
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I believe Eastman make several, including at least three in their laminate series.
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As mentioned, Stephen Holst will build a laminated archtop to your dimensions for $3500. Mine is modeled after a Borys/D'Aquisto B120:
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Campellone, Benedetto, Buscarino.
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Great guitars, but the OP said $3500 budget ... (which could be certain used Benedettos ...) Originally Posted by Jazzstdnt
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Benedetto guitars with the exception of Pat Martino model and 335 styled guitar are all 25" scale length.And the 2 aforementioned models are 1&11/16" width as well.
Perhaps Eastman does have some Thinlines as Jim Soloway mentioned in above post. The new Romeo model looks promising for sure!
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Benedetto does custom and "one-offs" in all ways imaginable.
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oops, missed that. Originally Posted by marcwhy
too bad we can't afford to pay more for our custom archtop dream guitar.
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Mark Campellone built some of his 16" Standard models with 24 3/4" scale and 1 3/4" or wider nuts.
I have seen them sell used in the region of your budget. That's for an instrument with a carved top, carved back and solid rims. Lovely guitars.
Some Heritage 575 models (16", 24 3/4" scale) were built with 1 3/4" or wider nuts.
I have seen them sell used for well under your budget. That's for an instrument with a carved top, carved back and solid rims. They can be lovely guitars as well.
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Could by 4 Loar LH 650s! Originally Posted by marcwhy
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First of all, many thanks for all of your suggestions. In a sense, buying a guitar is like buying a pair of shoes. You pretty much know if it's going to fit right away, then there's a bit of a breaking in period to see if you become more comfortable with it (or them.) The challenge here is that guitars are orders of magnitude more expensive than shoes. The L-4 I bought can easily be returned for a full refund within the evaluation period. But when we buy from a private party online, we either have to live with the result or go through the hassle of reselling it, typically for a loss after transaction fees. You have all given me some really good ideas, from a $650 Loar to luthier quality instruments. I'll keep hacking away on the L-4 for now, but honestly believe it's a lost cause. Best to all of you!
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If you have the time, you can custom order a guitar from either Wu or Yunzhi, built to whatever specs you desire. Bout width, neck width and depth, scale length, inlays, depth, everything is negotiable. Actually, it's not negotiating, it's just specifying what you want, and they will build it. It takes 3 months or so, but IME it's worth it. My Wu is a great guitar, and required no work other than installing the pickup, as I ordered it as an acoustic. I prefer the Rhythm Chief 1100 over the Chinese pickup that is standard, but you can have it come with the pickup installed for about the same price. A Wu will run you ~$1500, a Yunzhi somewhat less. If you want a factory-built, ready to ship guitar, I think an Eastman is a good choice. Lots of models have 1.75' necks. Personally, I notice no difference at all between 24.75" and 25" scales. A quarter of an inch over ~25 inches isn't much, and the difference in fret spacing is vanishingly small, as is the tension. But in the end, it's an entirely subjective matter as to whether a guitar is acceptable to a player.
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Eastman 805CE is a solid wood, 16" lower bout, 1.75 nut, 25" scale, floating pickup guitar. I personally don't like the look of the cutaway, but I bet I could get used to it.
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But seriously.... what's wrong with the L4? The 1 11/16" nut is just 1/16" from 1 3/4. Does 1/16" feel like a lot to your hands? For some it would. I think narrower than 1 11/16 I'd notice, but I actually never even realized my Loar LH650 was a 1 3/4" nut until I measured it for this thread. Flatter fingerboard radius too. I never really noticed it before.
The L4ces is a prince of a guitar. It might be worth giving it some time to grow on you.
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For pure acoustic tone, I've never had a better sounding guitar setup with a Bill Gagnon cherrywood bridge combined with a Bartolini 5j floater. Man what was I thinking selling that guitar! It was outcast while chasing another L5 on a retirement budget. Nuts!
To the OP, you've got to be careful acquiring just any Loar. Some have improper neck height issues. But when you get a good one, I'd rate a LH650's tone as superlative.
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