Fender Tone Master DELUXE Reverb

[Greco]

Quoting Mr. lawson-stone...

"I hope someone will give us a thread on the ToneMaster Deluxe Reverb (TMDR) as well, but for now, it's the Twin!"

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________

I would like to hear comments from anyone who purchased the TMDR over the ToneMaster TWIN Reverb (TMTR)

Apart from the factors of less overall weight/physical size and a lower price, what were the other deciding factors that
helped you to deicide?

Thanks.

[Ray175]

For me the main factor was that I don’t need more than the 22w that the TMDR delivers. I really don’t need 85w out of my amp.

Additionally:

• The price difference at that level was not an issue.
• The absence of a “middle” tone control can be solved by any half-decent eq pedal.
• The absence of a “bright” switch can be solved by channel jumping.

For someone playing with a loud drummer, or who needs massive amounts of clean headroom I can see the benefits of the TMTR - but that’s not my situation.

[Greco]

• The absence of a “middle” tone control can be solved by any half-decent eq pedal.
• The absence of a “bright” switch can be solved by channel jumping.

Your response is much appreciated. Merci.

Do you find that you you need to do the channel jumping to achieve the "jazz tones" you prefer?

I do have an EQ pedal to help with the absence of a "mids" control.

[lawson-stone]

The most obvious reason to choose the TMDR over the TMTR is simply a preference for that signature Deluxe Reverb sound. The DR is not just a 22 watt Twin Reverb, but has its own distinctive tone that most players really enjoy. I have a SuperChamp X2 head and I keep it on the 65 Deluxe model. I'm pondering getting a TMDR just because I enjoy that tone so much. The Twin also has its virtues and they are not merely calculated in watts. The two speakers at any volume have a fullness of sound, moving lots of air. The 6L6 modeling produces a different tone from 6V6 modeling, and the super clean tone is very nice.

Fender did a good thing by bringing out these two Tone Masters first.

[Ray175]

Your response is much appreciated. Merci.

Do you find that you you need to do the channel jumping to achieve the "jazz tones" you prefer?

I do have an EQ pedal to help with the absence of a "mids" control.

Channel 1 has neither reverb nor tremolo, so jumping channels not only allows to bypass the bright cap, but also to be able to use reverb when the guitar is plugged into channel 1 and “jumped” to channel 2. I prefer the jumped Channel 1 sound for jazz and pop, but pure Channel 2 for blues and rock.

Lawson is right to underline the fact that the TMDR and theTMTR have their own distinctive sounds - since my musical tastes are pretty eclectic, I prefer breakup to come in earlier on the dial - theTMTR has more clean headroom and pushes more air with its 2 speakers, so at mid to high volume I guess you can physically feel the sound more than on the TMDR. A question of personal taste and functional need :-)
Hope this helps.
Ray

[Greco]

The most obvious reason to choose the TMDR over the TMTR is simply a preference for that signature Deluxe Reverb sound. The DR is not just a 22 watt Twin Reverb, but has its own distinctive tone that most players really enjoy. I have a SuperChamp X2 head and I keep it on the 65 Deluxe model. I'm pondering getting a TMDR just because I enjoy that tone so much. The Twin also has its virtues and they are not merely calculated in watts. The two speakers at any volume have a fullness of sound, moving lots of air. The 6L6 modeling produces a different tone from 6V6 modeling, and the super clean tone is very nice.

Fender did a good thing by bringing out these two Tone Masters first.

Channel 1 has neither reverb nor tremolo, so jumping channels not only allows to bypass the bright cap, but also to be able to use reverb when the guitar is plugged into channel 1 and “jumped” to channel 2. I prefer the jumped Channel 1 sound for jazz and pop, but pure Channel 2 for blues and rock.

Lawson is right to underline the fact that the TMDR and the TMTR have their own distinctive sounds - since my musical tastes are pretty eclectic, I prefer breakup to come in earlier on the dial - the TMTR has more clean headroom and pushes more air with its 2 speakers, so at mid to high volume I guess you can physically feel the sound more than on the TMDR. A question of personal taste and functional need :-)
Hope this helps.
Ray

Thank you for all the valuable information. I am learning a lot from this... and I hope it helps others.

I know our local store has a TMDR, but I'm not sure if they have received a TMTR to date. The "proof is in the pudding" and I need to try both amplifiers models side by side.

[TedBPhx]

Love the TMTR! Never played a Deluxe new or old. All previous amps have been 1x12s or smaller so I jumped on the chance to move more air at low volumes. But I wonder. Can someone release their inner poet and describe the difference in tone and... feel?

[archtopeddy]

I have the TMDR. My main reason for the DR over the TR: I wanted something that would fit in the front seat of my Honda Civic. The lightweight was awesome and the attenuating feature was great and useful.

I'm lucky I guess. I didn't really understand the sound and tonal differences between a DR and TR. Those factors didn't influence my decision.

I know that from day one I've been totally happy with my TMDR. In trade, I dumped a couple of heavy amps I wasn't using and spent only a $100 cash for the difference. I've used the TMDR at numerous gigs and use it everyday at home. It's my go to daily amp -- and that's saying a lot since I also have a Roland JC-60, an AER Compact Mobile, and a Henriksen Bud. To my ears, the TMDR is just fine for rock, jazz, blues, reggae, and more. Tonight I'll take it out for an acoustic-set of music and see how it works. I suspect it will be just fine.

[lawson-stone]

I have the TMDR. My main reason for the DR over the TR: I wanted something that would fit in the front seat of my Honda Civic. The lightweight was awesome and the attenuating feature was great and useful.

I'm lucky I guess. I didn't really understand the sound and tonal differences between a DR and TR. Those factors didn't influence my decision.

I know that from day one I've been totally happy with my TMDR. In trade, I dumped a couple of heavy amps I wasn't using and spent only a $100 cash for the difference. I've used the TMDR at numerous gigs and use it everyday at home. It's my go to daily amp -- and that's saying a lot since I also have a Roland JC-60, an AER Compact Mobile, and a Henriksen Bud. To my ears, the TMDR is just fine for rock, jazz, blues, reggae, and more. Tonight I'll take it out for an acoustic-set of music and see how it works. I suspect it will be just fine.

Truth spoken. My TMTR is my default amp for most daily practice and playing. The output power selector is a wonderful feature and the line out with its own level knob makes recording from it so drama-free. These are truly "working" amps.

[Jimmy Mack]

Let me jump in here, from FAR- left field, disregard if you like.

Without ever trying a Tone-Master, I watch these threads. Professionally, I play in a Blues/rock group, in smaller venues (bars), at home , it's jazz and blues-jazz.

My Princeton Reverbs, original and Rivera II, are too loud for my gigs. I have owned 3 or 4 Twin Reverbs in my days of gigging the big rooms, and just recently sold my Fender Concert of 60 watts with 2 -10's, because it was TOO loud. Seriously Twin Reverb loud!

Hard for me to understand why anyone needs a Twin, unless you are playing LARGe rooms, and if you are, my hat's off to you. I would go for the DR. And, I would love to see a DR with 2-10's. Maybe Leo had it right when the Vibrolux Reverb came about - and how many players have pined for the VR to be re-issued in it's BF form? I'll bet most would have a vintage VR if they were affordable. I would. ToneMaster is a great start, but the VR should be the next TM

[archtopeddy]

Hi Jimmy Mack. A TMVR would be very cool, but I suspect that the next TM might be a TM Princeton. There's been a bit of talk about that on some of the other sites. And, it would give Fender a third, smaller size TM. While many would say that a Princeton is already pretty light weight, I'd imagine a 12 pound Princeton with the output power selector and line outs and level knob would be an attractive item. Just my thoughts...

[Tal_175]

Channel 1 has neither reverb nor tremolo, so jumping channels not only allows to bypass the bright cap, but also to be able to use reverb when the guitar is plugged into channel 1 and “jumped” to channel 2. I prefer the jumped Channel 1 sound for jazz and pop, but pure Channel 2 for blues and rock.

Aren't the channels on the Blackface amps out of phase?

[archtopeddy]

Just a quick update on yesterday's gig with the TMDR: I used a 40's laminated Harmony archtop with a $20 Chinese floating Johnny Smith pickup and it all went great! The guitar has it's own woody and unique tone. People always comment positively about it -- especially other guitar players.

I set the output power selector to 5w. It had plenty of headroom for the gig (restaurant-size bar and meeting room; band included two guitars, bass and drums). I also took a page from Jonathan Stout's book about using a clean boost and used my Grace Design "Bix" instrument preamp for quick volume adjustments between solos and rhythm. I didn't use any other pedals.

I've used the amp now with Teles, Strats, Ibanez Roadstar, vintage '59 Airline Town and Country, 30's Gibson ES-150CC, etc., etc.; every time I've been happy with the sound. It's a Fender sound. Sometimes I may want a different sound; in that case, I'll use a different amp. But overall, it's a great jack-of-all trades Fender-sounding amp.

BTW, I also bought a thick-padded TUKI cover for it. It has the velcro flap on the bottom and fits the amp snug as a bug. I figure as much as I plan to use this amp, I'll be knocking it around a bit so a good padded cover was in order. (If you wish to get one, you need to order one for the TMDR not the regular DR. There is a slightly difference in size).

[Ray175]

Aren't the channels on the Blackface amps out of phase?

Tube Blackface amps indeed have their channels out of phase, and a jumpered non reverb tube Deluxe produces a stronger overdrive in my experience.

Whether the solid state circuitry of the ToneMasters follow a similar logic, I have no idea - I don't have the technical knowedge or understanding to check that out. What I can say is that jumpering my TMDR clearly gives me channel 1 sound plus reverb and tremelo.

Interesting post on this subject here

[GregoryL]

I would buy a TM Princeton Reverb the moment it’s released - I really hope it’s coming.

I’ve played a SFPR for a long time and am in the market for a subway-friendly amp. Some good options like the forthcoming ZT Lunchbox Reverb, but I’d much rather have a PR. Plus a PR has much better tremolo than a DR, IMO.

I suspect Fender would sell a ton of them.

[lawson-stone]

I would buy a TM Princeton Reverb the moment it’s released - I really hope it’s coming.

I’ve played a SFPR for a long time and am in the market for a subway-friendly amp. Some good options like the forthcoming ZT Lunchbox Reverb, but I’d much rather have a PR. Plus a PR has much better tremolo than a DR, IMO.

I suspect Fender would sell a ton of them.

I expect you're right many because of product placement. The Twin Reverb sits at the top of the power hierarchy with the 2x12 and 85 watts of seismic clean. Then the Deluxe Reverb comes in at a moderate power 22w and 1x12, with a distinctive clean and driven tone signature. The Princeton would nicely fill in the lower end of the line, 1x10", 12-15 watts, and it's own distinctive tone yet again. These 3 would be a powerful lineup. I have the Princeton Reverb Reissue and while it's not unduly heavy, the same performance in a package 1/3 to 1/2 lighter would really catch fire.

Much as some of the others like the Vibrolux Reverb or Band Master make sense, my hunch (all it is, just a hunch) is the symmetry and cleary produce placement of TR/DR/PR would be the likely plan.

But who knows... I"m still pondering whether to sell off some stuff to get a Tone Master Deluxe Reverb... not that I need it, but since when has this really been about NEED??

[Jimmy Mack]

If this TM thing really takes off.... IF! A PR seems like a given, and so does the VR. 1 10" spkr,
2-10's, 1 12", 2- 12's. Don't forget the Tweeds! Bassmen, Deluxes, Supers, Harvards.
Time will tell

[73Fender]

The last non tube amp I tried was 45 yrs ago and we know what they were like back then.

As I grow weary of chasing bad tubes etc the idea of trying one of these seems interesting.

I would love to see a comparison of the TM amps with Fender's Mustangs. They just introduced a new line of Mustangs at NAMM. I'd be curious to see how close the Mustangs, with their extra bells and whistles, would come to a TM.

https://www.fender.com/articles/gear...the-namm-floor

[Gitterbug]

The Jensen NAMM booth had both TMDR and TMTR. The DR received all the attention and was the most tested amp. Despite sound-proofing, there was too much background noise for proper A/B listening, but to me the DR sounded just great. The Jensen guys have worked hard to make the new N 12 K Neo sound as authentic as possible. It will be available as a replacement speaker during Q1. Of course, most of the testing was with distortion, but haven't Fender's SS cleans always been ok?

[SkipBurz]

On Friday afternoon, my local music store got in a Fender Tone Master Twin Reverb and Tone Master Deluxe Reverb. As a life-long Fender Blackface owner/player, I have been wanting to demo a TMDR since they first came out. I was there when the store opened Saturday morning with my 335, 175 and an A/B pedal in hand. I spent an hour and half going between a tube DRRI and the TMDR. I was so blown away by the sound of the TMDR that I took it with me when I left (after paying for it, of course). And can I tell you how nice it was to be able to carry a 335 on my back, a 175 in one hand, and Deluxe Reverb in the other?

Apart from the sound, the first thing that sold me was the power attenuator. For playing straight up jazz gigs, I can leave the power on 22w or 15w and keep the volume control below 5, giving me plenty of clean headroom. However, right now I'm playing in a pit orchestra performing Hairspray. In rehearsal today, I was able to turn up the volume until I got a little "hair" on the tone, and then attenuate down to 5w to get my stage volume under control. Secondly, the sound of the the direct out is incredible - especially the SM57 and the Royer ribbon mic simulations.

It's going to be a nice compliment to my Princeton Reverb RI (12"). If you get a chance to play one, I encourage you to do so.

[Ray175]

Welcome to the ever-growing club, Skip! For working musicians like yourself this amp is heaven-sent. After a month and a half I'm still exploring its capabilities.....

On Friday afternoon, my local music store got in a Fender Tone Master Twin Reverb and Tone Master Deluxe Reverb. As a life-long Fender Blackface owner/player, I have been wanting to demo a TMDR since they first came out. I was there when the store opened Saturday morning with my 335, 175 and an A/B pedal in hand. I spent an hour and half going between a tube DRRI and the TMDR. I was so blown away by the sound of the TMDR that I took it with me when I left (after paying for it, of course). And can I tell you how nice it was to be able to carry a 335 on my back, a 175 in one hand, and Deluxe Reverb in the other?

Apart from the sound, the first thing that sold me was the power attenuator. For playing straight up jazz gigs, I can leave the power on 22w or 15w and keep the volume control below 5, giving me plenty of clean headroom. However, right now I'm playing in a pit orchestra performing Hairspray. In rehearsal today, I was able to turn up the volume until I got a little "hair" on the tone, and then attenuate down to 5w to get my stage volume under control. Secondly, the sound of the the direct out is incredible - especially the SM57 and the Royer ribbon mic simulations.

It's going to be a nice compliment to my Princeton Reverb RI (12"). If you get a chance to play one, I encourage you to do so.

[lawson-stone]

I am amazed at how many people who really put the time in to give the Tone Masters an informed, careful trial, are really happy. Only a very small number come away unimpressed. My TMTR is tied with my PRRI as my go-to amp, and recording with the TMTR is so easy that I tend to default to it. I actually forget sometimes how light it is because my set-up is pretty stable and I don't play out much. Still, if I have to move it for some reason, I am always expected "Twin Reverb... 70 pounds" and then BOOM it's so light.

Please post some clips of your amp! I'd love to hear it.

[TedBPhx]

Extremely happy with my TMTR. Using the direct out for headphone silent late nights is a joy. As is recording! Take off the phones, flip the mute and no difference in sound.

I recently read of a jumpering trick on Deluxes to do... something? Wonder if it works on a TMDR.

[Greco]

if they ever make a Super Reverb.... I'm in!

I was recently talking to one of the employees at our local music store. He had been to NAMM and spent a lot of time with the Fender reps as the store is about to stock their Custom Shop line of products. Apparently there is a plan to bring out another amp in the ToneMaster "series" and, logically, I asked him if he knew which amp would be next. I said that I hoped it would be the Princeton Reverb (PR). He said he couldn't tell me anything specific, but indicated that he was "very doubtful" that it would be the PR. Maybe it will be the Super Reverb!!??

[Ray175]

Extremely happy with my TMTR. Using the direct out for headphone silent late nights is a joy. As is recording! Take off the phones, flip the mute and no difference in sound.

I recently read of a jumpering trick on Deluxes to do... something? Wonder if it works on a TMDR.

You're maybe thinking of getting channel1 sounds but with reverb and tremolo?

• Plug guitar into input1 of Channel 1
• Jumper Channel 1 input 2 to Channel 2 input 1
• Set Channel 1 volume to zero
• Use Channel 2 controls to mould your sound

You now have a Channel 1 sound with the possibility of reverb and tremolo using Channel 2 controls. Works fine on my TMDR.