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I am shopping for a cheap small guitar amp.
Behringer makes a practice amp called the Firebird GX108. It's a 15 watt solid state amp that had gotten good reviews. I was looking for one on Ebay, when I ran across the bass version, Thunderbird BX-108. It has the same cool vintage appearance and similar specs and it was only $40.00. What could I possibly lose?
I gotta admid, this is a very fine sounding little amp, especially for jazz. It's extremely clean sounding and gets pretty loud, too.
I'm curious if anyone else out there has tried it...
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03-20-2008 11:11 AM
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I don't know that particular amp, but everything behringer that I've owned or tried was just tolerable to be benign, if you're looking for a practice amp to play at home, I would consider the Vox Pathfinder, or a little Roland Cube, I haven't tried one of those little tube amps like the fender champion, but they say there's a number of fine copies from Harley Benton or Fame that are amazingly cheap
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The Beringer stuff is REALLY hit or miss. The local store where I spend most of my $ quit carrying them this past year because they sent back almost as much stuff as they sold. Many items not working out of the box.
There is a Musician's Friend Clearance Center here also, and it is always chock full of Beringer stuff. Thing is, if you get some use out of it, great because the price is so cheap. However, I would never trust it outside of what you are talking about.
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I own a Behringer V-Tone GMX210. I bought it used from a local dealer for a hundred bucks. They sell new for about twice that.
Shortly after I got it it exhibited a noisy power supply, which the dealer fixed no charge. Neither he or I had any idea how old it was or how it had been used when it was traded in on the more powerful GMX212.
I think it's a pretty good amp for the money. It has a lot of useful features, especially the various inputs and amp and speaker models.
The effects are a bit over the top. there are so many of them! I primarily use a bit of reverb and chorus. It's very useful to be able to use combinations of reverb with chorus, delay, phaser, etc. It's also useful to set the two channels to different effect settings and switch between them. The footswitch is included with this amp. By the way, the User's Manuel is available for download at the Behringer website.
My experience with Behringer products has, by and large, been positive. My first amp ever was a Fender Twin I bought in 1966. That was a great amp and there are many examples of those still around. They sell for a lot more than the GMX210, though.
Since I seldom play out anymore the Behringers suit my purposes just fine. They sound good, have all the features I need, and are cheap. My advice to you is to buy one from a local dealer rather than one of the online mail order guys. That way, if you have a problem you can have it taken care of locally. Preparing a 30 pound amplifier for shipping can ruin your day.
I hope this information helps.
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Small bass amps are usually good for jazz. The tone is a little darker and usually cleaner. Danelectro used to make a small bass amp that had a great reputation as a jazz practice amp. I think small bass amps, even cheap ones, have less muddy sound, especially for the wound strings on a jazz guitar.
My vote for a good sounding cheap amp for jazz is my Crate GX-15R. I paid $75.00 used, but they can be had for less. It has a good clean channel and a nice overdrive channel that sounds suprisingly good for jazz if you use just a little edge of distortion (think sixties George Benson). I put a Jensen Mod speaker in mine for about $20.00. I even recovered it in red tolex and put in oxblood grillecloth. The reverb is a real spring unit. Keep in mind most cheapies don't have much power, and when you use them next to a really good expensive amp, they don't sound as good. But at home, or in a friend's living room, they do the job, and it is fun to find a good one.
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Hi Larry,
I have the amp you're talking about. Bought it when I made a short-lived foray into electric bass. I actually tried the amp out to play jazz guitar not to long ago and was also surprised that it sounded quite good for that purpose. I also own a Roland cube 60 which gets some nice sounds for jazz so I mostly use the cube. Reason I tried the bass amp for guitar was that I read about how the Fender Bassman was found to have a great guitar sound. I am glad to hear that other people are discovering the same thing about the Behringer.
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The late 50's era Fender Bassman combo is one of THE most highly sought after amps. In the book"GUITAR RIGS, Classic Guitar and Amp Combos" The author names it along with the Stratocaster from the same time period as the classic R&B duo ever.
I'm not putting my little Behringer in that catagory. I'm just saying that, for an under $100.00 amp it provides a really nice clean sound. I'm sitting here right now, with my G&L plugged into it, finger picking some 12 bar blues and it really sounds good. A wonderful little living room amp.
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Just to bring it up because I think it's pertinent and not to throw mud.....
This months Guitar Player has a blurb about Beringer and their Chinese plant. There is one caption that mentions tube inspection and how they usually wind up throwing out 1/2 as QC rejects. Their intent is to show how well they monitor their production. But the truth is after discounting the 'spin' is this does not speak well of the parts they use.
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Behringer has such a price point advantage. They have little R&D expense as they ignore copyrights and they have low labor costs as they build in China. I haven't had experience with their amps but their pa speakers and their mixing boards (both Mackie rip-offs) are consider a real value.
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i know this is a terrible attitude, but at this price point, the stuff is almost disposable...if you get a year out of it, you've got your money's worth, right?
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Larry, I'm familiar with the BX-108. I bought one for my older son some years ago when he expressed an interest in playing bass guitar. I can imagine that BX-108 would make a very nice practice amp for guitar.
I have a number of pieces of Behringer gear. The biggest disadvantage of owning Behringer gear is that of having to deal with the Behringer-haters when they see what you're using.
Behringer is just another option. FWIW, I see no evidence that they're copying anything except physical appearance. Just because a Behringer mixing board *looks* like a Mackie, or a Berhringer pedal *looks* like a Boss or an Electro-Harmonix does *not* mean that the guts are identical or even strongly similar (beyond providing mostly-equivalent functionality).
Behringer is all about mass-production. They keep their costs low by using inexpensive labor and extensive automation. I don't know if any of you have ever been involved in creating a mass-produced product (I have), but there's a lot of expense and overhead beyond R&D. FWIW, R&D expense as a percentage of product cost is normally very low; even if Behringer *was* copying designs literally, they're *definitely* not saving enough money by doing so to be able to sell product at 1/2 to 1/3 the price of the name-brand look-alike.
I don't know of *any* company that starts with a completely blank slate when developing a product. There are *remarkably* few true innovators, and a *lot* of copy-cats.
Behringer reduces their marketing costs by exploiting visual similarity. When they make a look-alike product they piggyback on the marketing efforts of the name-brand manufacturer. The consumer is already familiar with the features and benefits of the name-brand product. So long as Behringer delivers comparable functionality, the user now has a choice of acquiring a strongly similar product from two different manufacturers at two dramatically different price points.
A lot of people cite Behringer for having questionable "business morals". These people are unclear on the function of a corporation, which is to maximize profits. A company will tout "soft values" such as morality, eco-friendliness, community service, etc. only to the extent that such actions are perceived to increase profits. Corporations have a long history of breaking laws when the cost of fines and legal battles is less than the increase in profit as a result of the illegal activity.
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Laney make some great amps for the money.
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Okay, I'll weigh in since I write a blog called "Cheap Guitar Guy".
I'd check out the modeling amps, particularly the Vox and the Roland Cubes. I had a Pathfinder and wasn't crazy about it. I like my Valvetronix and its Vox models better. Roland's Cubes should be checked out too.
Bass amps aren't a bad idea at all because the 15" speaker will sound a little more, well, bassy, which is why you roll back the treble on your jazz guitar to begin with. More headroom, often higher wattage, and that's done to achieve clean tones.
I just picked up a 2x12 Crate 100W amp for $129 because it was clean. I found a handful of used Crates in the area, but this one was sans effects, which is what I wanted. Not portable as a practice amp. But then the ZT Lunchbox at $259 is very small and clean if you want it to be, and LOUD (200 watts).
As for the Behringer debate, the quality is probably hit and miss, as you'll find with a LOT of budget-priced items, and sometimes even the higher end stuff.Last edited by woyvel; 01-23-2010 at 07:07 PM.
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Check out the IBANEZ SW20 or SW35.
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Buy a Peavey off of craigslist or something, a bandit or something, you could probably get one for less than a 100 dollars.
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Now that someone mentioned my favorite tone trick of playing through a bass amplifier, has anyone tried the LINE 6 LowDown Studio 110. [I've never been a big Line 6 fan because to me LINE 6 just screames metal distortion and feedback] but this little amp is a 75 Watt 25 lb 12" box with four bass amp models two of which might sound OK with a guitar. Anyone tried one of these little buggers?
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Another choice:
Vox Valvetronix VT15 15W 1x8 Guitar Combo Amp.
Currently on sale at Musician's Friend for $170.
I also agree that small bass amps often make good jazz guitar amps.
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I agree with the bass amplifier concept. I've used Standel, Univox and (my all time favorite) Fender Bassman - still have two out of the three. All work exceptionally well for jazz unless one demands icepick highs!
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just in case (i know this post is quite old!), i own three amps, and one of thems, my favorite practice amp, is a small bass amp, it sounds just amazing with a jazz guitar, super clean and clear and with a lot of body, the brand is marathon and the model MBA-25, i tell you, it is indeed the cheapest amp ever, i don't even know the price 'cause i got it for free when i bought some second hand stuff!!! but if you have the chance to try a marathon, DO IT!!!
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80s solid state amps - cheap, reliable, clean and loud.
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Hi jorgemg1984! can you give me some brands of 80 amps so i can watch more carfully when i go to the second hand stores?? thanks!
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Sure!
If you do a search here on the forum you will find threads on the subject.
I am not an expert but here it goes: Yamaha G series (used by Mike Stern and Pat Metheny back then); Peavey Bandit 65; Fender M 80; Music Man RD (hybrid solid state / tube); 80s Polytones and Roland Cubes are also well regarded;
These are the ones I know. I have an M80 and a Bandit and like both (I have upgraded some stuff on the amps but they already sounded good stock). I have tried a Music Man and like it a lot but they are usually more expensive. I know people who played 80s Polytones and also loved them (heard it from guys that I respect a lot).
About the M80 and the Bandit they are not what I would call brilliant! But they are very cheap, last forever, are usually loud and clean all the way. With a good pedal board behind them they are killer (a speaker upgrade usually helps also). But stock they provide all the cleanness you need for jazz pratice or gigs (they also come with a good reverb tank usually). You can score one for less than 100US sometimes... and I bet there are many other good options out there!
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Why is the Bandit only really praised for it durability and volume? Is it not a good sounding amp for jazz?About the M80 and the Bandit they are not what I would call brilliant!
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They sound good but not as good as my Jazzmaster Ultralight or a good Fender amp. But they cost 1/10 of those two...
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I worked alot in restaurants and one of the best jazz amps I have used is the Fender music master (bass amp) . weighs like 10 lbs and sounds clean and warm. Isn't that what we all want for most jazz anyway. I have also had great luck with cheap peavy and crate solid state amps that cost next to nothing. The cool thing about jazz guitars is that you can get away with cheap amplification and still get a killer tone. I was concerned about appearances for a while but then I went out and saw Tim Fitzgerald and Bobby Broom here in Chicago and they were both playing through 100.00 peavy amps. If it sounds good, then it sounds good.
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