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Hi everyone
I am research the history of Polytone amps - mainly the Brute models. Here is what I've found so far. Please feel free to point out anything that does not sound accurate! I haven't included anything about the MB V because I am just interested in single speaker models.
The first Brute launched was the Mini Brute, mostly available in four variations, before the I and III were eventually dropped. Mini Brutes hit the right spot; they were louder and fuller than the smaller 60-90 watt 8” Teeny & Baby Brutes, whilst being more portable than the older Mini Studio Series & Taurus Elites. The Mini Brute I (12” speaker) and III (15” speaker) were the two core designs, whereas the II and IV could have optional extras such as reverb, distortion, and foot switches as shown below. Grills, cabinets and panels and even the logo all varied over the years.
Single Speaker Models Speaker Reverb Mini Brute I 12” No Mini Brute II 12” Optional Mini Brute III 15” No Mini Brute IV 15” Optional
Despite being a hit with musicians, Mini Brutes did not fare well in guitar magazine reviews due to their “lack of features”. Polytone’s response to this was the sonic circuit design, but most still prefer the old straight forward panels.One benefit that newer models was more volume, meaning that musicians could get heard at gigs using the smaller 8” Mega Brutes (essentially an updated Baby / Teeny Brute). I can personally recall one gig in which my 10” tube amp distorted, so I switched to the lighter Mega Brute which stayed clean all night!
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02-09-2022 04:23 AM
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Jamieh, I'm surprised no-one has responded. After all, Polytones command a cult status similar to ES-175's. Alas, I cannot contribute, having heard them only sporadically and with no first-hand experience. "Lack of features" rings a distant bell, though: I believe the erstwhile Finnish importer had to offload their inventory at a significant loss due to the lack of a dirty channel. Where these amps went, no clue. Just two guitarists and one bassist I know of still use Polytones.
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When did the Brute amps come out, what’s the timeline?
I don’t know much about ‘em.
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polytone.htm
Don't know if the OP saw this site or cares to.
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Well, someone tried to get started on it about 10 years ago, but as yet there is little to no actual information:
Polytone Amps & All That Jazz | Polytone Amplifiers Deserve More Love!
Probably the largest collection of Polytone lore on the Internet might be right here:
https://www.jazzguitar.be/forum/sear...archid=2178446
Some more tidbits:
POLYTONE AMPLIFIERS, POLYTONE MINI-BRUTE II, POLYTONE MINI-BRUTE V, POLYTONE SONIC BASS, POLYTONE TAURUS ELITE
polytone.htm
POLYTONE SERVICE INFO
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Yeah, the tiny pieces of history of Polytone are here and there.
An article about jazz accordionist Tommy Gumina, the Mr Polytone tells this:
"Gumina started the business in the '60s and since that time the greatest jazz guitarists and bassists have entrusted their tone to Tommy Gumina Polytone amps and equipment. The sound on guitarist George Benson's mega hit "Breezin'" was achieved through a Polytone 120-watt model 104. Gumina tells it: "When I first started Polytone I didn't have a background in electronics but I took a course at UCLA because I wanted to know about the business so consequently I have become fairly decent in the electronics field."
https://www.allaboutjazz.com/tommy-gumina-tommy-gumina-by-elliott-simon
The people in 70s and 80s didn't appreciate Polytone amps because of the"lack of features". It is the irony of history that these days aficionados appreciate mostly the Polytone models that suffer from that "lack of features". The early Polytones with only bass and treble and reverb are good, but if it has also a mid knob or distortion or the sound circuit it is bad.
The history of the Polytones can be divided at least in three eras: diamond vinyl cover era, black felt era and the black tolex era. Other eras can be divided too!
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What happened to Polytone? Why are they no longer made? Surely an amp supposedly so good would be in demand?
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What happened?
Tommy Gumina died and the company basically didn't survive him.
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As said before, I'm no expert, but from what I've read, Polytones have been all over the charts in terms of circuitry, features, cab architecture and speaker size. Forums (fora?) like this are crowded by people who intimately know each variant of each classic Fender design and are keen to arrange them in a pecking order. I'm intrigued by Polytone's mythical/monolith reputation, because there must have been significant tonal differences. If the basic circuitry was the result of Mr. Gumina's one-year electronics course, surely there can't be some secret snake oil that can't be discovered through reverse engineering. There's been references to Germanium semiconductors, which I'm led to believe were more less individuals. This topic must have been dealt with ad nauseam. Yet, anybody with insight into the Polytone electronics please raise your hand (once more...)
Originally Posted by Litterick
Last edited by Gitterbug; 02-11-2022 at 03:08 PM.
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You could argue that Henriksens are "modern" Polytones. Originally Posted by Litterick
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That was the idea. Henriksen was designed to be the modern Polytone, a great solid State Jazz amp with lighter weight and greater reliability. Originally Posted by BigDaddyLoveHandles
I was a Polytone user starting in 1974 (when I witnessed Joe Pass using one at an upstairs gig at the Village Gate in NYC. After watching Joe walk down the steps with his Mini-Brute in one hand and his guitar in the other, I went to Sam Ash on 48th street the next day and bought one). I sold my last Polytone on this forum a few years ago after the new generation of Class D Henriksens came out. For me, the Henriksens do everything that a Polytone did, only better. Cats like Jimmy Bruno and Bruce Forman agree.
Tommy Gumina made great amps in his day (his customer service always left a bit to be desired), but he is gone and so is his company. I doubt there is enough demand to reinvent the company and for those who love Polytones, there are enough extant examples to find one. They are all getting a bit long in the tooth, so beware. These were not the most reliable amps in their day, and that reliability is not getting any better!
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Perhaps not, but think about how much pent-up supply there is of people clamoring to say "the reissues are nowhere as good as the real thing". That alone might serve as a basis for some enterprising hoarder of original Polytones to deliberately manufacture cheap look-a-likes. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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That's a great tidbit of trivia, did not know that. Originally Posted by Herbie
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Just to let everyone that Jamie has posted the full video project:
<a data-cke-saved-href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cWfDkHN0W8" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cWfDkHN0W8">
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ok but in this world
you can buy a DV little jazz for £300 ....
so so what would you pay for a
new Polytone ?
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Unfortunately, a Polytone made with modern parts, wouldn't really be a Polytone. The smart thing to do is buy an old one that still works, bring it to a tech and have them do a basic service. It will be good for another 20 years.
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I really dig the tone. The knobs were trashed so I replaced them with something classier. I was hoping that the reverb circuit was at least on the circuit board, so that I could populate it and add a tank. Sadly that isn’t the case.
Sooner or later I am going to build a new cab for it, the current one has a couple of chips. It’s such a great amp I’d like to make it look a little more “boutique”.
For a point of comparison, I think it sounds way better than my DV Mark Micro Jazz through my open backed cab with a Cannabis Rex in it.
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The schematics referenced here are for later brute versions.
The power amp/power supplies for these were all on a separate chassis, located on the bottom of the case.
The early versions of these power amps(Model PA378) in the 102, 103, 104, & brutes used an IC voltage amp/driver stage (LM391N-80), which was discontinued. It was subsequently replaced by a simplified circuit (PA378B) using a pair of transistors, instead. All the amps used a pair of Motorola TO-3 output transistors rated for high current and low voltage, which necessitated the use of a low impedance loudspeaker (3 Ohms) in order to achieve maximum rated output wattage. The supply rails for the output stage were only +/- 33VDC.
The MB2 was a favorite of guitarists, since it had reverb and a 12" speaker, was compact, & light weight.
The MB3 was frequently used for upright bass, as it had a larger 15" speaker and lacked effects. Early units had CTS speakers, & later production used Eminence.
The damping factor was decreased by inserting resistance in series with the speaker voice coil, to bring it closer to a tube amp sound.
Cabinet styling evolved, with first gens having quilted urethane foam grills, which disintegrated & fell apart, followed by cloth, and finally, expanded steel mesh. Cabinets were covered with various patterns of Tolex, starting with fuzzy black, later blue diamond, and leather-like black, among others.
We've serviced a number of these over the years for friends, dealers, and ourselves.
We play our own archtop through a MB4, to this day.
Happy to help anyone looking to restore one of these!
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my local shop got a mini brute 2in.It has a toogle switch and plain black with a foam grill.in good shape would the toogle switch help place it date and has anyone played one.I love my 80s mini 4.
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I'm curious what you all think of this service as a way to bring some old Polytone units back to life, or keep them going with more flexibility: turning one into an amp head, and then converting the amp into a cab. Notice this is the non-reverb version, which avoids some problems. (not sure why the link looks like this, but it does work)
Just a moment...
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Dear people of sense! We're in the 21st century, like it or not. Polytones are extinct. The ones still alive will go belly-up sooner or later. Do they really sound so good they're worth resuscitating time and over again? And if they do, why hasn't anybody been able to replicate them? What's wrong with contemporary Henriksens, Quilters and others out there? I'm 78 but prefer to look ahead. Probably because I had no moments of glory - whether listener or player - in my youth.
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I know I shouldn't say this but my MB III has given me no problems in 30 or more years. I've done it now!! Originally Posted by Gitterbug
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Well, if there is such thing as 'vintage solid state amp', Polytone is that. The copies are alright, but as long as there is originals among us, some want to use them. Originally Posted by Gitterbug
I don't play my MBIV often, but when I ask myself (about twice a year...) should I sell it, the answer has so far been 'no'. It is good reminder how simple things can be!
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Why not. I like combos better, but I know that some like heads more. I don't see anything wrong in this. Originally Posted by Johnpiazza
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I play my Polytone about 3-4 times a week, and still I marvel and how it sounds. It just renders the traditional archtop guitar so nicely. I also have a Fender Tone Master Twin Reverb, which is becoming my favorite amp, and a Fender Princeton Reverb, which I also love; but the Polytone really has a quality that I love and don't hear in other amps.
I would LOVE to see the kind of sophisticated modeling that went into the Tone Master series applied to the classic Polytone sound. I'd buy one in a heartbeat.
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