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Seller says its only the lacquer. But in your opinion, do you think it will spread and become a serious problem eventually?
Any advice appreciated!
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03-02-2022 08:16 AM
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Anytime I see a crack spreading from a corner in a 90 degree angle it is a cause for concern. Only the finish appears to cracking but again, the top of each crack aligns with the lower axis of the joint. IMO this can only be caused by stress. You did not mention the age of the guitar or if it is under warranty. Seems the seller wants to minimize the issue, so contact the manufacturer and see where it goes.
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That's from stress on the lacquer.
Will it spread? Nitrocellulose checking commonly does pop up in areas on the over time. It doesn't harm the instrument and possibly helps the acoustic resonance.
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Looks like just a lacquer crack (at the moment!). Keep an eye on it though. Is it a nitro finish?
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No its poly. Its a 2019 Epi Broadyway
Originally Posted by adamrhowe
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Its a 2019 and I doubt still under warranty. Its being sold for a good price, but I'll probably just pass. Not worth the worry. Thanks! Originally Posted by Oldjock
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Thanks for the insight. What do you think causes stress like that generally? A poorly aligned truss rod? A poorly glued in neck? Originally Posted by Oldjock
The guitar I currently own has had similar cracks in the finish in the same area of the neck. I play the guitar about 2 hours a day and over the course of the few years I've had it I think its gotten a little worse. But luckily its still just the finish.
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I have a modern epi broadway like this. It’s got so many finish cracks in scary places. As far as I can tell none of them have gotten worse.
For what its worth, I think it’s a great guitar if you want the Fender scale.
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Worry about things like this is really why it is hard to sell things at times. This means zero.
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Since those finish checks are where the binding meets the wood, my experience tells me its from the wood expanding/contracting, and the binding not moving with it. I really doubt its anything to be concerned with.
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Probably a build up of the finish on the edge when it was initially sprayed. Think of dragging a paint brush on the edge of board or wall corner. When the nut was put on it smashed that built up edge down and cracks radiated from it. The string tension contributes to it as well. Not a big deal but cosmetically not a great look IMHO. Originally Posted by VanEpsInDeChirico
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......Are the cracks on both sides -- strings 1 and 6 ?
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That would be a reason to reject a new guitar. But using that reasoning I'd walk away from any used guitar that had a ding anywhere because it means there was trauma, which is true.
I can go out on a limb and say I wouldn't be too concerned but certainly wouldn't pay full retail. I'd take some money off because others would be hesitant to buy it later. It is likely true that there was some blow to the back of the headstock or someone put on very heavy strings. There obviously had been some stress applied. I'm not sure that's the original nut BTW. The checks could be due to a nut replacement.
If this was a major investment I'd check the bracing and truss rod function, not because of the checks but just because.
IMO those are very low risk checks.
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Much ado about nothing imo
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I've seen 2 guitars with that kind of crack, that in the end turned out to be the fretboard desolidarizing (does this word exist?) from the neck. My luthier just glued it back and it never moved again.
But I would be a little reticent now buying a guitar with that crack.
It can be fixed but I'd prefer avoiding going thru the stress.
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Its just on one side
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It’s all a matter of probability. The likelihood of hidden damage and future problems is hard to estimate, but it’s clearly higher than baseline. So the real question is how much it’s worth to accept the risk. This is no different from buying stocks or investing in a business opportunity. The reward of a lower price and potential future profit (in money, joy, or whatever else the buyer finds rewarding) has to balance the risk of a costly disaster. Originally Posted by Jimmy blue note
I've seen many instruments that were fine, all of which sported this telltale scar. I've also had a Gibson Les Paul (nitro), an epi Les Paul (poly), a Gibson 339 and a poly 335 that opened up and split months after the discovery of the check. All were grain splits roughly along the glue line, all of which required major work to put back. Again, I feel like chicken little here. If you're one of the ones for whom nothing happens, it's nothing. If you're one of the ones that are not so fortunate, well you know, shit happens.
I'd say buy it and if it opens up, post photos here on the forum. I think it'll give some real life perspective or on the other hand if it stays intact, you'll have a perfectly good guitar with some little marks in the finish. We all love a story with a happy ending. Sometimes it comes from believing that everything will be alright.
Good luck
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I bought a new LP custom in the early ‘70s. I noticed a similar series of craze lines on the treble side about 2 years later and took it to the dealer for warranty repair. Gibson said it did not warrant repair. About 3 years later, the neck binding started to loosen from the nut down to the 3rd fret. They told me it was “normal wear and tear”. It remained stable until I sold it years later, but it irritated me every time I looked at it. It was barely palpable, but the gap was quite visible.
To me, no discount could offset the potential for trouble. But I’m risk averse.Last edited by nevershouldhavesoldit; 03-03-2022 at 03:42 PM.
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with the freedom of no luthier knowledge, I am just asking, there are zillions of guitars to buy outthere, pick an other one, an problems questions are gone, so why this one?
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I have an L5 with multiple repaired cracks in the rim, as well as the top. It's got about as many finish checks as there are stars in the sky, and I didn't think twice about buying it, and its a wonderful guitar that has served me well. If you're the kind of person who is bothered by 3 tiny finish checks, than the OP guitar isn't the guitar for you, but I can't imagine there's many used guitars out there for you. Using this whole "that could be a sign of significant trauma" reasoning to write this guitar off can send anyone down a rabbit hole. As others said, any guitar with a ding or a scratch could have suffered significant trauma. I mean...that just leaves pristine guitars.....and at that point its time to roll out the old classic "if its in pristine shape, it must mean it didn't get played, which must mean it didn't play well or sound good."
Last edited by customxke; 11-30-2022 at 12:35 PM.
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^
What he said.
If I let 3 tiny finish checks bother me I'd have to get rid of all of my guitars.
Maybe it's just me but I'll never understand the mint mint mentality, drop filling dings, etc. It's a guitar, just play and enjoy it.
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I’m sorry, but you can’t make that assertion as an absolute. How do you know that a previous owner didn’t take a razor, and try and relic it, and decided “no way”? You don’t. How do you know that the neck didn’t shrink just a tiny bit from lack of humidity, and the nut didn’t, causing those checks? You don’t. How do you know that a previous player didn’t try such an egregious blues-layer note bend that the nut shifted and crazed the adjacent finish? You don’t. None of these are a melanoma. They’re normal. Anything could have caused this. I’m not saying you’re wrong, but I’m saying you can’t possibly know. Originally Posted by Jimmy blue note
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I've never seen polyester or polyurethane finishes "check" the way that nitro finishes do. and my understanding is that they simply don't do that. I think some people commenting here are reasoning that since their nitro-finished guitars have cracks sort of like that this isn't a problem, but I don't think that makes sense. That guitar might be fine, or it might be toast; I certainly have no way of knowing. It might be fine because the force that caused the cracks was not enough to do significant damage in the wood, but it isn't fine because those are just finish checks caused by the way the finish responds to changes in temperature and humidity. They're not that. Unless I'm wrong about all of the above (always a possibiity).
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I agree w all of this....except the possible razor relic part Originally Posted by customxke
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What make and model is this guitar that is causing WWIII? Originally Posted by VanEpsInDeChirico
Seller says its only the lacquer. But in your opinion, do you think it will spread and become a serious problem eventually?
Any advice appreciated!
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When people post things about guitars and situations asking for opinions, that is what they get and opinion. They are not paying me to be their consultant so if someone does something, or buys something based on what I say it still is their decision. I have nothing involved in the situation and my advice is really worth nothin or very little. However there are folks on this forum that I value as supreme in level of expertise. I would hold their opinions up to the best however I would never give them grief over something I did taking there opinion.
If we don't have the guitar in hand it really is just an educated guess based more or less on experience. Even with the guitar in hand it can be hard to figure out some things that have been done. Buyers run the whole spectrum of expectations and some are incredibly picky and will bring up the slightest mark. Others can be quite open to marks and even repairs. It is hard to explain to someone who does not know much about guitar construction, that some situations are normal and some repairs mean almost nothing. It is probably best to underestimate the guitar when selling but sometimes a person does this and a buyer still has problems.
When buying a used archtop guitar from almost any brand that is over 10 years old one should expect some marks on the guitar. When buying a 30 year old guitar which is not exactly new, probably it will have more marks if it has been played regularly. When buying old guitars that are over 70 years old then one has to expect they are not new. Repaired top cracks, back cracks, binding issues are all part of the beast. Chances are if the guitar plays well and it is fully up to pitch if it has survived for 70 plus years it probably is going to be fine.
In this particular case as I look closely at it is simply a finish issue. I don't see any telltale signs of cracks in the wood that indicate a problem. It could have been caused when new and they pull the masking tape off finish. Wood and finishes expand/contract at different rates it is usually more to it if trauma. That is my opinion.
Just take the great Jimmy D'aquisto, he made some of the finest guitars ever period. During a period of time some of the guitars developed binding issues and have had to be rebound. If arguable the greatest maker in history has a few issues then relax things are not going to be better from another brand of guitar. Jimmy did not expect that to happen but over time but it did, risk buying even new. Bill Hollenbeck used a traditional dovetail neck and I would assume the joint could be opened and neck come off. However when Bill glued the neck on he never intended it to be removed again period. The late Jimmy Foster told me that if he had to remove a neck on one of his guitars, he was going to be getting out the saw and saw it off. Much easier and less work.
Ok I am done.
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