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Hi, I'm asking anyone who has a Yamaha sa2200 what minimum string height you managed to achieve without compromising the sound? In millimeters please. Thank you
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10-27-2023 11:41 AM
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That's going to depend on the height of the nut slots, the amount of relief in the neck, and how even the frets are in height. It can vary a lot just based on those factors. To get the lowest possible action, the neck has to be perfectly straight, the frets perfectly even, and the nut slots cut to the perfect depth. Anything less than perfection in any makes the action somewhat higher. I haven't played that particular model guitar, but on my guitars, after a proper setup I can get the action to about 1mm, provided I use a rather light touch with the pick. A heavier picking hand requires higher action, and everything is intertwined with everything else.
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The fretboard is perfect and so are the feet. It would be useful to know the opinion of those who have my guitar. 1 mm before string? And 6 strings?
Originally Posted by sgosnell
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I think what sgosnell is saying is that action is a function of setup, playing style, fret noise tolerance, string gauge, scale length etc. not model and make. There is no such thing as Yamaha sa2200 action or ES 335 action. Originally Posted by Karlos
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I had an SA2200. I was able to take the action down relatively low. No one here is likely to be able to tell you how low yours can go - all of the previously-mentioned factors play into it, coupled with where on the fretboard you are measuring the action, your chosen string gauge, and your playing style. I think mine was somewhere at around 3/64" - 4/64" for 1st the string, and a slight bit higher for the 6th string (maybe 4/64" - 5/64"). You can convert to mm. I was playing 11s at the time I think. I thought the fret leveling and neck were decent enough (but not as good as the ones I've seen on, say, the Comins GCS-16 models).
Get the neck relief where you feel comfortable, and start dropping the string height via the bridge adjustment wheels until you find where it works best for you. You'll need to factor in the likely re-intonation step via the bridge saddles when you get the action close to where you like it. It's pretty simple, will take a few iterations, and doesn't take too long. There's really no other way to figure it out.
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They are well made and consistently good build quality guitars. Easily on par with Gibson ES 335s, even CS models.
A real steal in terms of value.
Some folks do not like the pickups, but that is subjective.
They setup easily. All of above advice is spot on.
Should easily be able to get in the 3/64 to 4/64 range on high E.
4/64-5/64 on low E with no issues.
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I have 4/64 at the high E and a little more at the low E, maybe 5/64.
These numbers come from the Fender website setup guide, although I apply them to other brands. It's a very good resource, worth reading.
I play light strings except high E, 11-42. The low E is hard to tune, so that's a trade-off.
The idea is to keep the action feeling soft. A trapeze tailpiece is helpful for that too (the non-vibrating length of string still stretches and affects the feel), although my main guitar doesn't have one.
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The possible action does not depend on the model of guitar, but on each individual guitar. If everything is perfect, IME 1 mm at the 12th fret is possible, but it also depends on the playing style of the player, which has nothing to do with the model of guitar. You're asking a question which is impossible to answer accurately. What is low enough to not affect tone to me, may not be the same to you, and it's not the same to me on different guitars. But assuming that the setup is perfect and you have a light touch, 1mm is not out of the question. A perfect setup is rare, though.
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As pointed out by others, each guitar is an individual. You are in the best, actually monopoly, position to experiment on how low you can go with your particular sample. What a fine instrument it is!
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is![/QUOTE]yes true it's a nice guitar! But I don't understand, here in Italy ?? there are many used cars on sale for 1500 euros! Originally Posted by Gitterbug
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I guess if you put REALLY heavy strings (in the Pat Martino range) and tuned up a half or whole step, you could get a lot more tension, less lateral string movement and you could get even lower.
If you pick really light with a set up like this, or if you played Stanley Jordan tapping style, you definitely could get a super glissy sound with ultra low action.
At some point, you can get a lower action than anybody else can play IF you change your own technique beyond what anyone else can do. In other words, there's a point where extraordinarily low action is in the hands. If your own style demands this kind of ultra low action, then you get beyond measurable numbers specs and into a guitar with tolerances that only YOU can play.
I knew a guy with action so low, I couldn't play it without buzzing; the wind was nearly enough to make it play. Yet he played it clean. He played so light and his amp was set louder than I could ever control, yet it was in his fingers. He spent a lot of time perfecting his hand control to play that light.
Go for it. It might be your niche.
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I remember seeing a Jerry Reed video in which he said he wanted his action so low that he could blow on the strings and fret them. Hyperbole, of course, but I'm pretty sure his action was lower than average. I'm not totally convinced that Freddy Green used such high action purely for tone, because the rate of return on that starts decreasing rapidly well before reaching that height. I suspect more was involved, but I never met him and am certainly no authority on him. Action height is always a compromise, and where to compromise, and what factors to consider by how much, is a subjective decision. Techs who just set the action to the same height every time without consulting the player about preferences, strings, playing style, and watching them play are just hacks, and will never give ideal results. Acceptable, perhaps, but never ideal.
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Yeah I have the luxury of working off a preferential client list and I always include a 60 day adjustment period. For me, I have to adjust my action for feel and what I'm doing musically. And I do this seasonally. Originally Posted by sgosnell
I happen to feel that the individual finger/hand feel is a much truer critera of where and how string height should be set. Only your hands know what is needed in a guitar to realize the music your soul and body feels.
Maybe it's off topic but it's why I don't set up by the numbers. My opinion anyway.
I worked for Ibanez. I was told the "proper" specs to set up to. The powers in charge were the first people to tell me those specs were intentionally set as a LCD guideline to cover the most aggressive players and assure no issues when frets were not optimized at the factory. It strengthened my resolve never to set up by the numbers in own professional practice.
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Factories have to use numbers for setups, because they have no idea whatsoever about who will buy the guitar. I've never played a new factory-made guitar which had a good setup, and it's no real surprise. Trying to get low action is time-consuming, and going just a little too far can require a new nut or other parts. It's easy enough to take material off, but impossible to replace it once it's gone. I have no expectations about playability of a factory-made guitar, because I know it won't be what I prefer. I don't really consider high action a defect, because I can change that. I do consider poor fretwork - uneven, undressed frets with sharp ends - a defect however, and just won't bother to buy a guitar with that defect. Good workmanship in manufacture and good setup are not at all the same things.
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Here's the truth: Factory guitars are set up high on purpose. A good fret job and pro-grade leveling will take maybe 30% more time on the bench (or whatever...it's wasted production cost) and that's for the handful of players who play light and accurate enough to actually utilize a guitar set up that precisely.
Meanwhile if you set it up low and fast, 70% of the customers who take that guitar off the wall at Guitar Center are going to strum it hard enough to hear some kind of rattling or buzzing. Put that guitar, put it back on the wall and buy brand B which the salesman can thrash and it sound like a symphony.
I asked my manager on the line where I worked "Can't I set this up so it plays fast and easy?" and he said "I has to play clean no matter who's playing. If they want it that low, they get a setup after they've bought the guitar." Then he said "Most of the people who buy these guitars will give it up a year after they bought it. They want to buy a guitar that plays loud and clear. What they do after they paid for it, that's not our affair."
Honestly, that's factory spec and the mindset that it's addressing.
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