Looking for a "jazz box"

[Phil59]

I want a guitar to play basically Charlie Christian/Django/swing/blues stuff. A Gibson ES175 would be too big. A few years ago, I sold a Gibson ES 125TC. Probably a mistake. Also sold a Gibson ES135 with p90s. I have a Heritage 535 so the Gibson ES 335 thing is covered. Maybe a thin body p90? What do you think? Thanks.

[Jimmy Mack]

The Epiphone 1961 RI Casino is a great guitar, if you can score one. It was a limited run, and very much different from the run-of-the-mill Casinos of today. Unless you want to spring for the USA/Gibson/Epiphone Casino. I have not played one of those.
But they are all hollow, and lightweight, mine has a thin ply top so it is very responsive - a great guitar by any means.

[frabarmus]

I want a guitar to play basically Charlie Christian/Django/swing/blues stuff.

D'Angelico Style B (the one on the right in the picture)

[dconeill]

I want a guitar to play basically Charlie Christian/Django/swing/blues stuff. ... Maybe a thin body p90? ...

What's your budget?

[frabarmus]

The Epiphone 1961 RI Casino is a great guitar, if you can score one. It was a limited run, and very much different from the run-of-the-mill Casinos of today. Unless you want to spring for the USA/Gibson/Epiphone Casino. I have not played one of those.
But they are all hollow, and lightweight, mine has a thin ply top so it is very responsive - a great guitar by any means.

My Casino 2023 is very good for the money, plays and sounds very decent even all stock. Great for "no worries-gigging".

[Oscar67]

The Eastman 580CE could be an option and it could be a lifer. Solid top, laminated back and sides, not too big, not too small, extremely well-made.

[Phil59]

What's your budget?

Sorry, should have said. $2,000 max, preferably $1,500.

[olejason]

If you're not opposed to a full depth guitar an ES-125 would be hard to beat with that budget. I'd string it with rounds for CC/Django tones.

[John A.]

Sorry, should have said. $2,000 max, preferably $1,500.

Thin hollowbody:
Gibson ES-120T
Guild T-50
Epiphone Sorrento Reissue (there are some with P90's and some with mini-humbuckers)

Full:
Gretsch G5420T
Gretsch G5422TG

Not sure that any would get you the sound you're looking for, but they all fit the bill of "smaller than a 175" with pickups that are either single coil or more single-like than a typical archtop humbucker, and all be found for less than $2k

[mr. beaumont]

I might throw in a vote for the Godin Kingpin.

The 175 is a deep guitar for an archtop, I think that's what makes it feel large.

[Oscar67]

Sorry, should have said. $2,000 max, preferably $1,500.

Excellent instruments can be had in that range, especially when buying used. Based on this price range I’ll echo the Eastman 580 CE once more.

[Jabberwocky]

Check out one of the Archtop Tributes at Walkin JP. Masaki-san is a standup proprietor. 新入荷商品/New Arrivals

[Rickco]

If your looking at the D'Ang B you might want to consider the Guild T50. I just got a Dynasonic model, quite happy. allusedguitars on ebay (yeah i know...) still has a couple open box for $750. Not marked b stock or 2nd mine came perfect, is absolutely flawless in cosmetics and construction and came with Dadario 11 rounds set up at 4/64. The setup and fret work are immaculate. Unplugged its loud enough for practice with a warm jazzy tone. Plugged in it goes toe to toe with any sub $4k lam top Ive played or heard. Thin feeling 9/1/2" rad neck not for full neck lovers. AUG was great is established Guild dealer mine came with 90 day factory warranty. I dropped the action to 2/64 and strung it with 10g 80-20 bronze and it has no reason to blush in the company of very nice high end archtops. The standard model is sunburst and has a "p90" to be honest Im not sure I would pay full retail as that gets you closer to a decent 125t which will retain its value but Im not convinced it would play or sound better. I would definitely choose it over a 120. Just a thought

[Phil59]

Thanks for your suggestions. It seems to me that the Gibson ES 125TC I sold some time ago is the best option. Now they're too expensive. Time will tell.

[John A.]

Thanks for your suggestions. It seems to me that the Gibson ES 125TC I sold some time ago is the best option. Now they're too expensive. Time will tell.

There’s an Epiphone reissue of that (google Epiphone Thorogood). They’re tough to find, but worth taking a look. An Epi Sorrento is basically the same thing.

[Phil59]

There’s an Epiphone reissue of that (google Epiphone Thorogood). They’re tough to find, but worth taking a look. An Epi Sorrento is basically the same thing.

Those look interesting, will check them out, thanks.

[ThatRhythmMan]

I have no experience with these, but they are certainly affordable. I have no idea if they would get the sound you want.

UpTown Kat ES | Epiphone


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[Rickco]

Thanks for your suggestions. It seems to me that the Gibson ES 125TC I sold some time ago is the best option. Now they're too expensive. Time will tell.

I agree, theyre grossly overpriced and the '60s epi equivalents are also priced silly. I had (on loan for evaluation) a 125t some time ago. I will say at the old bargain prices these were great. The one I almost had was offered to me for $400.! and Ive played a few epi equivalents. To me the T50 I just grabbed plays and sounds just as good (mabey better) bearing in mind the price point and target market. None of these inexpensive imports are going to be Borys or D'Aquisto (not a fan of sadowski, when i play as good as Bruno ill try one again) but either were the 125t or the epis. The epi TRM just mentioned would be well worth looking into.

[jazzloverfat]

If your looking at the D'Ang B you might want to consider the Guild T50. I just got a Dynasonic model, quite happy. allusedguitars on ebay (yeah i know...) still has a couple open box for $750. Not marked b stock or 2nd mine came perfect, is absolutely flawless in cosmetics and construction and came with Dadario 11 rounds set up at 4/64. The setup and fret work are immaculate. Unplugged its loud enough for practice with a warm jazzy tone. Plugged in it goes toe to toe with any sub $4k lam top Ive played or heard. Thin feeling 9/1/2" rad neck not for full neck lovers. AUG was great is established Guild dealer mine came with 90 day factory warranty. I dropped the action to 2/64 and strung it with 10g 80-20 bronze and it has no reason to blush in the company of very nice high end archtops. The standard model is sunburst and has a "p90" to be honest Im not sure I would pay full retail as that gets you closer to a decent 125t which will retain its value but Im not convinced it would play or sound better. I would definitely choose it over a 120. Just a thought

Hi Ricko, can I ask a few questions about your T-50?

So i'm currently shopping for an archtop guitar and i've narrowed it down to this and a semihollow from D'Angelico.

I think I find the T-50 the more interesting option, however there are some issues with regards to specs and the info available online. For example, I found conflicting info re: the body material for the Dynasonics models - some dealers list it as mahogany while others as maple.Then the same with the inlays... some say both P-90 and Dyna models have M-o-P inlays while others are listing this only for the Dynasonics. Any idea which is the correct info by any chance?

One last question... do you think the Dynasonic model can fit a P-90? I really like the Cherry Red T-50 slim but don't much care for the pickups.

Thanks so much for your time!

[Jx30510]

I'm also looking for a thinline full hollowbody with floating bridge, and the Guild T 50 with the Dynasonics has my interest. There's also the Starfire 3 Special with the Dynasonics (30 only run on Thomann). I wonder how those pickups sound? I really favor single coils these days, I love my AV59 Stratocaster..
I've looked at used Gibson 125 Thinlines, with the florentine cutaways, and the prices have doubled since last year when I was on the fence buying one. Really crazy ! I'm sure the almost 4000€ they're priced on Reverb is ridiculous for what you get.
So I'm interested for feedback concerning the Guilds thinlines. They seem really well built.
The Starfire III Special with Dynasonics is 1599€.. quite a bit expensive for a MIK guitar ? Or better value than a 4000€ Gibson TDC ? Talking value as an instrument, not a collectors item..

[Rickco]

Ive had mine for a month now so still trying different strings and action, that said heres what I know the body is mahogany which I believe is typical for Guilds as the starfire is also. The "MoP" looks authentic so if its "made of plastic" its a darn good imitation. The dynasonic outside dimension (pickup ring) is smaller than a humbucker ring which is all I had to compare it to. I have no info on the p90 nor can I find any but I image if it wasnt a drop in fit you could modify a little to make it work. You could call sweetwater and they should be able to get the info from Guild, after all theyre sales "engineers". Im going to grab my buddies '60 starfire today and compare it side by side. The fret board on the t50 is ebony, mines stripey like maccassar and I think it looks great. What impressed me the most is the setup and playability, of course I have no idea if I just got lucky or theyre really good at QC but it plays beautifully and action can down to a molecule (so far) with any string type or guage. Ive also only had the one experience with AUG on ebay but they are very responsive and are Guild dealers so it would be worth it to contact them. The 2 they have on ebay 1 red 1 blk are $750 (no case) I havent found any others that low. I will post some pics and anymore info including comparison to the old starfire tommorow. Im extremely happy with mine. Stay tuned and Ill add to this evening with pics and dimensions (im in ca) or tomorrow.

[chris32895]

Is an Archtop Tribute AT101 model not the same (or pretty close to the same) as the ES-125C? Not quite the TDC but an option. There's a used one on Reverb right now, but the price is a little higher than I'd personally like.

[Spook410]

Don't think the modern electric archtops would really do the sound you're looking for. Something with a bit more acoustic dry punch would be better? Too bad the price of a 50's Epiphone has gone up so much. Thinking the newer one's aren't going to sound much like the older ones given construction and materials.

I've never owned one.. but what about something like a Gibson L50? Seems they come up in this price range. Might be larger than you want but seems they would offer that swing you're looking for. You would have to be able to evaluate condition on a vintage guitar and know what you're getting into but nothing sounds as good for that early swing and blues clear, dry tone. Other than that the Godin Kingpin is worth a try though some don't care for the neck.

[Rickco]

I got lucky, not only did I get to borrow the Starfire but a really good player came over last night so I got to compare listening from audience perspective. Unfortunately the pickups are different so not able to hear that. Acoustically they were very close in volume and tone, loud enough for practice with very pleasing tone. The necks were also very close the T50 is .848 .914 (1st and 9th) the SF .892 .956 although the T50 felt thicker and without measuring they both felt very close. The SF body depth is 1/13/16 while the T50 is 1/13/16 upper bout flaring to 1/15/16 lower (very comfy) The SF is a '60 made in Hoboken NJ the T50 is a '23 Korean. From a quality of build they were the same both mahogany and flawless construction. The SF pickups are humbuckers and sound great. I have a bias toward the SF because its made in US and from the area I grew up. At the end of the night (both guitars played for hours through several amps) my friend said he preferred the T50 but only by a nose. If I close my eyes and just play I agree. If they were close to the same price it would be really tough to choose but I still think the T50 would win. Id still really like to have the SF but the owners not selling and if you look at the asking prices on Rev or EB I would never even consider it. The T50 for $750 was a no brainer and Im super happy with it right next to my 175 and nice archtops, In the $1000+ range Id have to do some comparing with other possibility's but it might still be the choice. Included a few shots, if theres anything I can add let me know (this is fun!) My friend has modified and had lots of experience with archtops he thinks putting a dogear P90 on the T50 would not be a problem but likely require some adjustment on the pickguard pickup cutout.

[Jx30510]

So your freind says he prefers the Korean T50 to his US made SF3? That says something !
Thanks for your thoughtful comments, very interesting.
How would you describe the sound of the Dyansonics ? Like single coil Fenders ? More P90, or maybe Dearmond Rythm Chief ?