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I first started getting into live music about the time I started playing guitar around six years ago. Up to that point, I hated live music, at least in clubs (loved concerts, however).
Now, of course, I am into it heavily. I can go watch a guy play in a coffee house and enjoy it as long as they seem to really care about what they are doing.
Which brings me to my main point and that is after reading about everyone from the old Blues players in the 1920's to some of the modern musical artists, I saw one great thread that seem to run through many of them and that was sacrifice.
They would rather struggle financially trying to make a living playing music than go out and join the workforce at a 9 to 5. When their music was in and times were good, there was enough work it seems for many. When times were bad and musical tastes changed, they were left plying a trade that had lessened economic value and therefore had less, or even no income.
Read this article about Jimmy Ponder who states that he spent many years earning an income below the poverty level. But he did not complain and accepted it as part of his sacrifice to be able to do what he really wanted to do.
Interview with Jimmy Ponder
Is is just amazing to me how many truly great and talented artists had to live in basements, or were homeless. Now I know many had a substance abuse problem that contributed to their state, but not all of them had a problem and many cleaned up (such as Joe Pass)
It is just so ironic to me how you see those old pictures of Jazz and Blues Players, dressed in fine clothing and smiling from ear to ear during their concert, yet many may not have even gotten paid for it or had a place to stay once the concert ended (unless they got luck with an admirer or had a fellow musician take them in).
I have read about Art Pepper, Joe Pass, Bud Powell, Blind Lemon Jefferson, Ma Rainey, Bessie Smith, and a host of others. It just amazes me how many of the stories have the same rise to fame, bad decisions made during the rise to fame, and then comes the fall that if left unabated often ends in losing one's mind, life, or both.
I almost feel guilty sometimes enjoying their music knowing many were, to put it simple, just screwed over again and again. Many were not saints themselves but man, at least throw some of them a bone! Don't just exploit them and then cast then aside like they were your prostitute!
OK. I am done.
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09-24-2012 11:13 PM
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I been like reading biographies of Jazz musicians and struggle is a common thread, but determination and persistence is also common. I'm reading the Grant Green book now and it talks a lot about the 60's and things were no better than the 30's and 40's were for Dizzy, Bird, Miles and so on.
When I went to GIT Howard Roberts would talk about wanting to become a guitarist and moving to Los Angeles and living out of his car so he could be in the right city. He also said how it would bug him when people would ask him to recommend a guitar teacher then say has to be in their neighborhood. Howard talked about taking the train from Arizona to Los Angeles to take a guitar lesson.
If you feel it in your soul you'll find a way to make it happen.Last edited by docbop; 09-25-2012 at 12:02 AM.
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I have read here several times that for many playing music is an actual calling, not unlike a calling to serve in a religious ministry or volunteer to go overseas and do aid work in a war torn country.
Originally Posted by docbop
This is an interesting tenet on human motivation. Not everybody has things that drive them, some just adapt and change. Others either cannot or will not - then they are at the mercy of the ever-changing world. There are wide-reaching implications here that many don't want to consider, such as having no retirement - not a good thing in a country that does not provide for the elderly or no health care, also not a good thing in a country that does not have a lot of free medical care.
Thank goodness for charities and churches and such. Monk had the baroness to care for him in his last few year so life. Many others had no one.
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In his formative years J.S Bach himself travelled by foot 250 km's to study with one of the leading lights of his day. The journey took a month he stayed for six months then returned home. No matter who says what about the"good old days", I ain't buying. It can only be a joyful struggle if it is being done right. That is the paradox of the whole thing.
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Have you read Django Reinhardts biography?
Music for him was a passion but initially a means of making money. Being a gypsy he really didn't need a steady income as he would be part existing off the land. Money for the finer things he craved (suits and gambling) had to be earned so at an early age he was a street musician on the streets of Paris. The accident that caused his left hand disfigurement was caused by the fire from cellulose flowers his wife made to make extra money. He had started playing jazz at this time but had to totally relearn guitar so that he could get back to the lucrative job of playing the new 'jazz' music that everyone was in love with at the time, very much the 'fat time.'
I wouldn't say he was driven to be a musical genius, more of a natural, much like master musicians from many diverse backgrounds and cultures.
When I hear his playing I hear his playful spirit and in opposition his melancholy which are historical documents in the genesis of popular music.
In the end he really couldn't adjust to how jazz changed after the second world war, he hadn't progressed and remained a throwback to the earlier small ensemble jazz of the early 30's.
But it is an interesting read, full of little stories such as sending his brother to play a session as he couldn't be bothered.
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For many years Wes Montgomery worked as a welder at the Mallory factory from 7:00 am to 3:00 pm, then gigged in local clubs from 9:00 pm to 2:00 am. The reason for this arrangement was the need to feed a wife and seven children.
Cannonball Adderley was instrumental in having him signed up with Riverside Records, which made him famous but still didn't bring him much money. Riverside owner Orrin Keepnews had to tell him with tongue in cheek: "Before you were a bum and broke. Now you are a star and broke. That's real progress."
It wasn't before late in his career, when he joined Verve and they had Creed Taylor arrange these pop albums for him, that he began to make real money from his music.
Wes died at the age of only 45 from a heart attack after having had spells of dizziness for some time - in hindsight likely due to disturbancies of the heart rhythm. He was a very responsible person and apart from heavy cigarette smoking, his was clean as a mother, didn't drink and didn't use drugs of any kind. His smoking could well have caused his heart problems, but his yearlong gruelsome work schedule may also have contributed to his untimely death.Last edited by oldane; 09-25-2012 at 10:38 AM.
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Arrgh!
That is to express my angst for Wes. That must have been the ultimate grind!
Yet still, his beautiful spirit came out in his music.
Much like Django (as mentioned by Jazzbow), these two did not let life's misfortunes and struggles turn their music into dark, somber dirges.
That says something about their character and resiliency.
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I've read both the Charles Delauney and the Michael Dregni biographies. More than once. Originally Posted by jazzbow
More importantly, I've listened to the recordings that Reinhardt made between 1947 and 1953. Django returned from his U.S. tour with Duke Ellington consumed by the flames of bebop. While the French music press and a certain portion of the public considered him "old hat", he quickly proved them wrong by recording original bebop influenced compositions with younger more modern minded musicians.
Your assertion that he couldn't or didn't progress is absurd.
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Originally Posted by monk
Jazz music was the pop culture of its time and the 'aged' artist will find themselves out of flavour eventually. Sure bebop was the flavour of the time at his passing and yes he did team up with younger players to become at once appealing and at the same time challenged. But to me and in my opinion he will always be associated with pre WW2 jazz scene and more importantly an innovator of acoustic guitar, not electric.
So maybe my comment was more mainstream, or even viewed as inappropriate but absurd? Nope, sorry.
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There have been may musicians in jazz who have weathered the winds of change. Miles Davis comes to mind immediately as a musician who continued to grow throughout his career. My point is that Django did adjust and continued to progress as a musician. I'll stand by my assessment of your assertion. Originally Posted by jazzbow
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Originally Posted by jazzbow
Jazz music was the pop culture of its time and the 'aged' artist will find themselves out of flavour eventually. Sure bebop was the flavour of the time at his passing and yes he did team up with younger players to become at once appealing and at the same time challenged. But to me and in my opinion he will always be associated with pre WW2 jazz scene and more importantly an innovator of acoustic guitar, not electric.
So maybe my comment was more mainstream, or even viewed as inappropriate but absurd? Nope, sorry.
Django will certainly be associated with pre WW2 jazz ...
but his later electric work is my favorite ...
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The only thing that stopped Django from progressing was death.
His 50's bebop material on his amplified Selmer smokes...
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Certainly, assessment, I like that word. It implies opinion and belief, nice. Originally Posted by monk
Assertion is a good word also. Self belief is a wonderful thing and in the light of friendly banter a point of view can be dissuaded from self delusion! (These words are great by the way, like me you like a lot of ass
)
True knowledge is a gift and should be shared with good will and empathy.
Absurd on the other hand expresses something entirely different and I took umbrage at that word.
Electric or acoustic, we all have our favourites. For me Pierre Bensusan thrashing his thing on a Les Paul with a Marshall Half Stack, or for that matter Zakk Wylde strumming on an acoustic don't make sense to me, interesting though
Make bridges my friend, not fires.
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One of the under-rated great electric jazz guitar tones of all time, IMO. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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I'm with you 100% about Django's electric sound and great bebop-inluenced playing in the early 50s. The pop and swlight distortion of the Stimer pickup was a cool sound and inn the annals of electric guitar tone, unique. Stochelo Rosenberg nails that tone and approach here.
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Thanks for your description on tone. This sound is very similar, in my opinion, to the Fender Deluxe Reverb cranked up past "5" on the vibrato channel. My bet is that if Mr. Rosenberg were to strike a chord with a lot of force, the sound would be really distorted. Originally Posted by AndyV
No disrespect my friend buy I am not a fan of this sound, personally although I have heard some music by Wes Montgomery and several others that featured tone similar to this, and I did like it. Those tubes ( I assume it was a tube amp) were really working.
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I wouldn't want to hear it all the time but I like it on single notes. Yes, on chords, not as pretty. I also like Gabor Szabo's edge-of-distortion tone but most rock distortion leaves me cold. Go figure.
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Ha, ha. I know what you mean. Originally Posted by AndyV
There are so many different tones when it comes to distortion. Some can be too harsh, too brittle, etc... Then there are some that you just don't want to hear used with a certain song or genre.
Same goes for voices. Who would want to hear Ella Fitzgerald sing a grunge song or Kurt Cobain sing an Ella song?
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