-
I know John Pisano. What else ?
-
10-08-2021 08:37 AM
-
Howard Alden, notably. Jimmy Bruno used to play 7-string, but hasn't recently. Ron Eschete. Bucky and John Pizzarelli. The start of it all, George Van Eps. There are more, I just can't think of them right now before my second cup of coffee. I've never known John Pisano to play 7-string, perhaps you meant John Pizzarelli?
-
Thanks ! Now go for your coffee !
Originally Posted by sgosnell
-
+1 on Eschete!!
-
JB never really played a 7 like a 7. Back in the mid '90s when I'd just switched to a 7 for all gigs, I was talking to him on a break during one of his nights at Chris's Jazz Cafe. He told me that as far as he was concerned, the only way to become a true 7 string player and to learn to use it fully was to "sell all your 6 string guitars". He never really integrated the 7th string into his style, and he apparently abandoned the 7 because he seemed not to find any advantage to it over a 6 in his playing. I suspect he simply didn't find the 7 sufficiently appealing to sell his 6 string instruments and climb the 7 string comfort curve. Originally Posted by sgosnell
I have no doubt that with his ability and experience, he could play a 7 (or an 8, or even a Chapman stick) with the best of them. I'm sure the decision to go back to a 6 was purely a rational personal choice, and it makes perfect sense to me. I tried an 8 a few times and felt the same way about it, although I'm no Jimmy Bruno and the learning curve was step enough for me on a 7.
Add Ron Jackson and Charlie Hunter to the list. Jackson's sadly unknown to most - he deserves to be on the same list with the others mentioned in this thead:
Hunter's currently playing a Hybrid Guitars Universal 7 that can send the 3 low strings to a bass amp or be played as a standard 7. Here are some great clips that show the evolution of his 7s over recent years:
-
Allen Hanlon switched from his Gibson L-5 to a Gretsch Van Epps 7 string in the 70's. When I studied with him (in the late 70's), I would play his vintage L-5 and he played the 7 string.
https://dutcharchtopguitarmuseum.nl/al-hanlon/
About 10 years ago, I bought a Van Epps 7 string (remembering the cool bass line comping that Allen did) and I hated it. It was heavy and the trebles were shrill and thin. I tried a couple other 7 strings and even an 8 string and finally realized that I am challenged enough by 6 strings. I did do many gigs with the 7 string and there is no doubt that the low A adds a lot to the sound. I do think Jimmy Bruno was right to declare that you need to play 7 string all the time for it to work well. Going back and forth produces more clams than I was comfortable with. YMMV
-
The production Gretsch Van Eps was every bit as bad as you describe...and worse. I played one at the original Manny's many years ago and also hated it. We are apparently not in the minority - I can't find production numbers, but I'd be amazed if they sold more than a handful. I'd be even more amazed if any was actually played for more than a brief period before being kicked down the road or hidden in a closet. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
-
The Master, Steve Herberman:
-
and with "our own", Chris Whiteman:
-
As always, thanks all for take a time and reply.
-
Lets not forget Kenny Poole.
-
or Lenny Breau on the high-A 7-string. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
-
There are a couple of interviews where Van Eps noted that he machined his own bridge tops out of brass (he had training as a precision machinist and in watchmaking); he used them both on his 1930s Epiphone as well as the Gretsch, apparently. That might have had a positive effect on tone of the high strings. I think I read that he made his own pickup for the Epi, too.
-
I don't know Jimmy Bruno, but from what I've read and seen in his videos, I think the switch back to 6 strings was indeed a personal decision, based largely on the difficulty in adjusting to it and the lack of a need for it. I think perhaps he just jumped on the bandwagon back when Bob Benedetto was turning out lots of 7-strings, and lots of players went to them. I also tried a 7-string, and found that the low A just wasn't necessary, at least to me. If there is a bass player, the 7th string just gets in the way, and does even when there is no bassist.
Another 7-string Benedetto player I had forgotten to mention is Gerry Beaudoin. He's a New England guy, and played with Jay Geils and Duke Robillard in the New Guitar Summit, among others.
-
Exactly - that's my point. He simply didn't find the 7 string satisfying enough to convert to it. I discovered on the first gig I played with my first 7 that it's impossible to play it like a 6 and throw in the 7th when the mood strikes you. It has to be an integral member of the string complement and you have to embrace it fully. I applaud Jimmy for recognizing and accepting this. A 7 is not "better" than a 6, and a 7 string player is not "better" than a 6 string player. You simply have to play the instrument that lets you express yourself best. Originally Posted by sgosnell
I agree to some extent on the former, but not at all the latter. I'm constantly aware of the need for care to avoid clashing with the bass. But I and the rest of the band are grateful for the 7th string when it's doing what it does best. Even with a bass player, having that lower extension frees the bass player to explore both rhythmic and melodic trails he or she would never consider without it. The secret to success is for everyone in the band to listen careful to everyone else. What matters most is the music, not the sound of your own instrument. Originally Posted by sgosnell
The ultimate example of the above is the interplay between Ron Eschete and Todd Johnson. It doesn't matter which of them is playing lead because there's always a rich background over which the other can soar.
-
Ronnie on his CB Hill guitar:
-
Of course there are players who are more than capable of listening and playing well with others. But I don't believe that it's easy, certainly not for me. The 7-string players I mentioned can certainly play without clashing with the bass. But it's hard enough even with only six strings. To sort of misquote Fitzgerald, "the talented are very different from you and me". The "you" not being directed at anyone in particular in this case, just the other hacks who play on my level.
-
I had Bill Barker make he a 18inch 7 string. I played if from 1985 till sold it in 1992. In the end I did not like the results. I have enough trouble with 6 strings for sure. The 7th string is just not enough clarity for me and going between that and a 6 is just too much work. In the end I generally have never cared for the work done by 7 string players. Not that it is bad but just the my favorite guitar playing to listening to is from those playing 6 strings.
I much prefer the work Lenny Breau did on his 6 string guitar in the early years it is way beyond anything I hear today. I also like George Van Eps but he is not someone I just go back to all the time. It is a bit too arranged and does not swing like say Joe Pass playing solo or Martin Taylor. Martin in particular gives the 6 string all the chord melody one could ask for. I much prefer Jimmy Bruno playing his 6 string. Try as did the 7 string is just not my cup of tea and the best player of this in my opinion is Ron Eschete but of course he really comes from a Joe Pass background I would say.
-
I think you are right. I think I said Pisano because I knew Eastman guitars have a 7 string model and a Pisano signature, things mixed in my head, and thought Pisano's model was the 7 string. My bad! Originally Posted by sgosnell
-
In part I want a 7 string because I really like to tune down my guitar, like 4 half steps or even more, I love the bassy sound it gives. In standard tunning all sounds too treebly to me. Im also thinking about a baritone guitar. And at this point about a 7 string baritone guitar, with at least the 7th string fretless. Ive never seen something like this. Originally Posted by deacon Mark
-
Check out Frank Winggold. Terrific solo CD released this year. Kenny Poole was mentioned earlier in the thread but I believe he actually played 6 string, detuned (or maybe with the 6th string tuned down to d). He was just very very good at the bass-plus-chords stuff. There’s also Fred Fried in Massachusetts. Now plays 8 string. Lotsa of self-produced records on 7 string, usually trio with bass and drums, and has a YouTube channel. Winggold plays both archtop and nylon-string, Fried is strictly a nylon-string player.
-
And FWIW I totally agree re the wretched non-quality of the GVE Gretsch 7 string. I’ve played 2 of them, and wouldn’t have taken either as a gift…
-
Bucky talked me into 7-string in the early 70s, when I was making trips to Manhattan to sit in with him at a little lounge on the upper West Side. I actually made a good living on it for many years, from solo to duo to bass-less quintets, but it's a real bear to do the Joe Pass style playing on, because when the bass drops out, it leaves a huge hole. I found a Godin 7-string Multiac nylon made for the Brazilian market some years back, and that became my main instrument until I developed focal dystonia in my right hand from practicing too much flamenco to intensely, and I eventually lost the control of my index finger. I still play the 7, as a side thing with a pick and hybrid technique, but I've gone back to the 6 and a more conventional approach. I would like to highly recommend John Pizzarreli's "Better Days Ahead" CD of Metheny tunes for a really excellent use of the 7-string guitar. I've known John since he was around 10 or 11, and opened for him a couple of times on his Ellington tour a few years ago. He has taken a large step forward with this new CD.
-
Kenny Poole told me he used 6 but tuned the bass strings lower. I never saw Kenny play a 7. Ted Greene told me the same thing about getting some of the bass voicings still using 6 strings.
We didn't mention Jimmy Foster, who was a lovely 7 string player, and Hank Mackie, Howard Paul, Jerry Simms, Alan DeMause, + Chris Buzzelli.
I went for a year playing only 7 string and after that came to agree with Jimmy foster's line that it was '6 strings with a bonus'; i am a singer, and the bass notes when playing up the neck are pleasing to me. I have found and i can alternate between 6 + 7 easier than i used to.
-
Another 7 string player worth noting is Taylor Roberts. And he’s happy to bring a pop sense on along with jazz. Worth a listen.
Reply With Quote
Mr Magic, guitar solo
Today, 05:45 AM in From The Bandstand