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Our standard for Nov 2023 will be Mack the Knife (Kurt Weill, Marc Blitzstein, Bertolt Brecht, 1928).
Background:
Jazz Standards Songs and Instrumentals (Mack the Knife)
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10-31-2023 01:27 PM
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Thank you, Oscar. Thing is, it should be faster than that and have lots of impressive bebop licks, but I'm limited :-)
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We’re all limited. My limit is nowhere near yours.
This song was actually my gateway into swing. And swing was my gateway into jazz. I saw Robbie Williams’ DVD from his Albert Hall gig shortly after it came out and it blew my mind that this music could be so exciting. Of course Robbie’s way of doing things had something to do with that, but the arrangement was really happening. It builds and builds and builds and it speeds up too. Back in those days I took some misplaced pride in my skills as a rhythm guitarist in other styles of music and mistakenly assumed that comping along to Robbie would be easy. All those key changes set me straight real quick. To this day I love comping along to some songs from that show. Great way to relax.
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You mean your limit's massive? Wouldn't surprise me! I just sit at home doing slow stuff with my thumb these days. Wasn't always like that. Mind you, it is very relaxing :-)My limit is nowhere near yours
Nevershouldhavesoldit will be along shortly to show us how it's done. He's pretty good. And he's older than me. Makes you weep.
Actually, I think this tune's trickier than it looks. Whole bars, or double bars, of Bb, Cm and F7 mean you've got to think of different things to play all the time. Not so easy.
Fancy giving it a go here? Or are you shy of it in public?
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You know what I meant with my limit ;-). Most of you here seem to be pretty good. Sometimes very good. Not me. Ask me to come up with cool parts for a song in other genres, ask me to play a nice solo that’s both energetic and melodic, I’ll do all that. But not jazz, not yet. Yes, I’m very shy about that in public. To the point of freezing up. Some day, though.
The song is certainly trickier. The chord structure stays the same with every key change so it doesn’t seem that hard, but I think Robbie’s version goes up a half step 6 or 7 times and that keeps me kind of busy. And as you mentioned, even with all the modulations it’s somewhat boring to keep playing the shame shapes.
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Yes, of course I knew, but there's also a lot of experience and competency in there I never had. I don't think many people start right off with jazz anyway, it's usually rock, blues, and all that. And probably a lot of the modern stuff is an acquired taste and a niche market.
I'd forgotten about the modulations. I was watching some sax player on YouTube the other day. He started off brilliantly, lots of fire and energy. I was expecting him to hit a breathtaking solo but the whole thing just went up a semitone and he just played the tune again, and then again, and then again, like an exercise. Bit of a cheat, really. At least he knew his stuff in lots of different keys!
I was listening mostly to instrumentals before and I hadn't bothered with vocal renditions but I've just heard Robbie Williams' version. Not bad, lots of energy, nice clear vocals and building excitement, as you say. Definitely an audience grabber and I can understand the attraction. He did it very well.
But the 'jazz' thing is strange. There are so many kinds now. And I'm fairly sure getting into alternate sounds, dissonances, and 'out' sounds becomes addictive after a while. Hard thing to break.
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Frank Sinatra recorded "Mack The Knife" as a duet live with Jimmy Buffet. Their big band kept modulating it up a half step, chorus after chorus, thru all 12 keys. It's easy chord changes and short form make it easy to do. George Coleman also practices "Mack The Knife" in all 12 keys, as he also does with Rythm Changes in all 12 keys.
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I just had to post it. So good!
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Great arrangement
Originally Posted by rintincop
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Probably the quintessential sax version.
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I was just thinking that. Originally Posted by ragman1
Great recording.
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There's a transcription around which is pretty good too, you can see the notes he's using. Quite interesting. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
On that recording they do something strange at the end of the two heads and before he solos (at about 0.42). Almost as though they were going to modulate and then changed their minds. What do you make of that?
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Interesting – Williams’ performance is a direct cover of Richard Wess’ 1958 arrangement and Bobby Darin’s performance of it. Originally Posted by Oscar67
This is a much darker version of the piece – a little more faithful to the Brecht original. The overture ends at 2:15, when the ballad begins. I loved this production.
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No doubt. Recorded so well, played so well… But in a wider sense I’m going to go against the grain: I’m not that keen on the idea of turning a truly great song into a 10 minute soloing platform. Despite the level of musicianship, my attention span dropped at the 4 minute mark. Originally Posted by ragman1
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Doesn't matter at all, it's all subjective. The jazz sound itself isn't for everybody, it's a niche market. Originally Posted by Oscar67
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I enjoyed the Sonny Rollins one. The Frank one is my favorite with the modulating each chorus and the band getting all hyped up. The Bobby Darin one was pretty good with the lame understated gesturing, funny how times were - that was entertainment. The Robbie Williams one, good god that's lame lol.
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Interesting picture on the Three Penny Opera vid. The ragamuffin figure sitting underneath the poster is no doubt supposed to be Jack Sheppard, a popular thief in London in the 1700's. Here's a sketch of him from the time.
But whereas this performance is much darker than the more modern versions it's still a gruesome tale. But unfortunately it has nothing to do with Jack Sheppard who in fact was non-violent and only stole and fenced things. But the other thing he was extremely good at was escaping from one prison after the other. In fact he was so good at it they eventually hanged him.
The character of Macheath, the knife-wielding killer, first appeared in the The Beggar's Opera by John Gay in 1728 and was apparently based on Jack Sheppard. But why the mis-characterisation, I don't know.
Just sticking up for the little guy :-)
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Found this great version. I suppose I should get around to playing instead of listening... maybe tomorrow.
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Zong... 15 rounds with Dave Van Ronk :-)
I didn't look away once, couldn't.
'In his autobiography, Dylan writes, "I'd heard Van Ronk back in the Midwest on records and thought he was pretty great, copied some of his recordings phrase for phrase. Van Ronk could howl and whisper, turn blues into ballads and ballads into blues. I loved his style. He was what the city was all about. In Greenwich Village, Van Ronk was king of the street, he reigned supreme." '
Dave Van Ronk - Wikipedia
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This is the Marc Blitzstein translation of the Bertold Brecht original. Bertold Brecht is the writer who wrote the original German lyrics, the composer is Kurt Weill (who also wrote -- among others -- Speak Low, September Song as well as the Alabama Song later covered by The Doors; the latter from a play in cooperation with B. Brecht as well). Originally Posted by Ukena
This is the original Brecht version.
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This is a fun tune.
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You're right. Fun!
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The version referenced in this post is most definitely not the Blitzstein version, which was sanitized for American audiences, and is the version Louis A. and Bobby D. used. Originally Posted by Bop Head
The 1976 Broadway version used a translation by Manheim and Willett, which they did not want produced. Richard Foreman, who directed the production, was living with Kate Manheim at the time, and so was able to get permission to use the libretto.Last edited by Ukena; 11-10-2023 at 08:18 AM.
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